Consultant Mastery Event Day 1 Part 1

Before we start, you all know who I am obviously, and I want to give you a little  bit of a preparation for what this is and how it's going to go and all other things  and I will [previse 00:00:20] by saying [inaudible 00:00:22] all my papers. I create  Powerpoints I rarely use, or I move them around and I am going to give you a  whole context for what this is going to be so that you're very comfortable and it's going to be in three points. Let me give you … I'm going to do that in context. I  plan it differently but I always change it.

I'll just give you the background of this and then tell you how I think it will play  out and then respect your intelligence is enough but you all appear to be viable,  if not, monstrously successful, meaningfully significant consultants or experts, so  I'm not going to waste any time. My goal in working with people is to produce  profound lasting shifts in their mind; shifts in how they see their place in their  cosmos, what they do, why they do it, how they do, the value of what they do.  Has anybody here … I know the [Spolding 00:01:27] … where's Chris? Your dad,  obviously, I don't know if you ever came with him, but your dad went, earlier in  my career when I was an animal about seminars to a lot of them and he watched  every permutation and derivative I ever did. Anybody been to any of my stuff? I  don't do anything here lately, so when did you go out to something?
Male: For the last 12 years I've been … I've never been to an event just you, but I've  been to the event [crosstalk 00:01:52].
Male: There was a super seminar in 2013.
Jay: Okay, which was …
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Male: I didn't go to it because I was in Alaska so I bought it.
Jay: Yeah. You're going to have to tolerate because I promise you will get where you  want by Wednesday, but if you want me to do what I want to do for you, you  [inaudible 00:02:12], I'm not a seminar giver. I'm somebody who really does this  stuff and I'm going to try to translate and transfer what I know but you have to  sort of work with me because I'm not in a hurry on the first day, so like a bullet  train coming out of the track. I want to get to know you and I'm going to do some dynamics that I think will be very profound in their elegance. The super seminar  was inspiringly disappointing to some people. Everybody wanted tactics, tactics,  tactics and I've transcended tactics because I've learned that with that strategy  and philosophy, the best tactics in the world are moot and I think that if … since I  don't know who is who I did review the little assessments of you but I haven't a  clue which one I'll find out soon. What is your …
Male: I thought it was fabulous. I've watched it now four times.
Jay: Yeah. I'm at a different place. When I started it … I've gone a full circle and I'm  going to give you my history in a little while, I'll tell you, we're going to do this,  but I started it with larger companies, then I accidentally got into the public  arena and started doing smaller companies and we did all these huge seminars  and at this point in my life I'm 65, I want my legacy to be … I'm very very blessed  all the smaller companies I've helped for a while but I want to work with larger  companies and some of the people who have influenced me are very big thinkers who think in much bigger terms than just making a living or doing tactical stuff  and I was trying in the super seminar to really convey that. I'm glad you liked it. I  was … it wasn't perfection but it was interesting. I don't know if I'll ever do one  again. It was an existing experiment.
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Anyhow, my style is totally stylish … style‐less. I totally function over form. I'm  not trying to be impressive, I have a mental context of what I want to do. If it  doesn't work I'll change it, I've got two different Powerpoints from two different  other applications that I think are translatable to you. I'm going to go into some  of them. If I don't like it I'll stop. My goal is to help you get what you want. The  genesis of this is that I have a partner in Japan who I've done a lot of work with  and they [inaudible 00:04:33], they have lots of consultants, lots of trainers, lots  of people and they'd asked me if I would do a program for four or five hundred of them and anybody who's got history, [inaudible 00:04:43], I used to do marketing consulting and training very expensive.
It was $15 to $20 thousand a piece and we did probably 1,500 people before we  stopped and we are very proud of the successes. I don't do this stuff in training  any more and I always like to do experimental pilots with little groups to see if  my ideas work well or not, so you're sort of going to be well enriched guinea pigs  as long as you tolerate the process, and the process is no process. I have an  intention and I'm going to walk you through exactly what I'm going to do, so no  surprises and I'm going to ask, and I'm sorry, [inaudible 00:05:22]. (Laughs)  There's nobody from [inaudible 00:05:25] here, is there? My best deal, so you  don't come back with a bloody cut and I'll go, “Oh!” You have to also like my  humor. I like [inaudible 00:05:33]. I'm not really a [inaudible 00:05:36].
Male: Maybe you should pull down the sleeves.
Jay: I forgot about this one part. I was telling Gena this is a bad insight into my history but in my many marriages one of the times I stayed here two months and going  through a divorce and I forgot every day at 5 o' clock I got awake and the first day it's really exciting. For example, I live … and I'll show you guys when we go in the  balcony, on a peninsular that's 25 minutes away, and in our neighborhood you  have horses and we have peacocks; beautiful peacocks, amazing peacocks the
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first day you see them. The second day they're pretty good then when they crap  all over the place and they fly into your house and they wake you up and they  mate at three in the morning and they have no natural enemies so they're just  like little rabbits and there's thousands and thousands of peacocks, you're  smashing peacocks and seals together, funny. Anyhow, this guys said, “You want  to do a seminar?' I said, “Aah!” and by the way, I'm going to give you Jay Ram but  I'm going to nestle in everything I say ideological, philosophical, methodological  … not [inaudible 00:06:46] but belief systems that sort of are going to be sugar  coated and just this dialogue will happen, but I believe it's very important to put  yourself into environments where you have to grow; where you can't do anything but walk through the tunnel because there's no object.
It's like Indiana Jones with the ball rolling behind him, those of you who saw  Raiders of the Lost Ark. I just came back and my [inaudible 00:07:07] may be a  little bit feeble this time because I take 20, 30 suites when I go to China and I take 50 ties and then I bring them and they get all cleaned and I've only been home  about a week but I was in China doing a $25,000 a person, 90 minutes on the hot seat through translation makeover and when I agreed to do it it sounded cooler  than shit. It's like, yeah, that will be fun. Then I get there and one of them is the  largest mining company and one of them is the largest producer of bulk rice and  noodles and one of them makes titanium wire and one of them is [inaudible  00:07:42] company owned by the government and one of them is a  pharmaceutical company and you go, “Oh shit,” but then you realize, excuse my  vulgar, you have no option but to go forward.
With this, once I agreed to do it, then okay, how am I going to do it? [Inaudible  00:07:57] okay, I'm going to do it the way that I would want it done for me; not  beautifully presented but transformative so that when you walk out the door you will really gain something that will be enduring and will help whatever expertize  you have and better monetize and that means you will be better contributed and
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that means you'll add more value and that means you'll make a difference and  that should mean that everybody will benefit including you, your clients, your  family, the community, etcetera. The way we're going to do it, you will love but  you won't like it in the beginning, and anybody that came to my old programs … I  did all kinds of experiments and I'm telling you this historically not to waste your  time, but if you don't appreciate the method to the madness, you won't  appreciate what we're doing parenthetically.
Where's Jeremiah? I'm doing something with Jeremiah in the insurance deal and  we're doing an introduction and we did three introductions; three calls, and the  first call I did was all philosophical. All philosophical, wasn't it. It's all about being  [inaudible 00:09:01], it's all about really being externally focused, all about really  understanding the client, all about empathy, all about understanding value and a  bunch of sore stuff and we got all these comments, “Why won't anybody get  more leads, why won't anybody get this or worry about that?” and in the next  call I said, well okay, let's presume I taught you how to hit home runs in baseball  but I didn't teach you the rules and I didn't teach you you've got to touch the  base, and I didn't teach you that even if you don't hit a home run, if you swing  four times and miss then it's moot, and so you had one of the skill sets but it was  a tactic. I'm a great believer that without the philosophy, without the mind set,  all the techniques in the world are feeble and they're not useless but they're disempowered, so on day one here's what we are going to do; I am going to make a  few just [inaudible 00:09:53] comments that are not random but they will all tie  together at the end.
Then I'm going to go around the room and if that doesn't matter to me how long  it takes, you will each stand up and you will tell us who you are, you will tell us  what you do, you will tell us why what you do is relevant to whoever you do it for and we'll know who you do it for, you will tell us what that relevancy translates to in some kind of measurable co‐efficient. Whether it's savings, productivity,
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profitability, it doesn't matter, I'm getting you started on thinking differently. You  will tell us how you currently mark … and I may interrupt you repetitively, it has  clarity. You will tell us how your marketing does and you will be very honest  because our goal here is intimate collaboration where I can help you be better  and I can share whatever meager things I know that will help you grow.
You will tell us the scope of your current business model meaning if you just do  consulting, if you speak, if you have a book, how the book interacts and I'll ask  you a lot of questions and it might take four hours and why you should be so glad we're doing that is it's highly improbable all you do the same things the same  way and all your models are the same and just by listening, there are some  people here who are very successful, there are some people here who are  successful, there are some people here who are making a living, but I can  promise you you're all not doing the same thing the same way and your  definition of how you're doing it differs and by the end of the first two or three or four hours you already have a breakthrough. Then depending on how we're  progressing, I will tell you my story and I will tell you as much or as least as I think is relevant and I'll go through my life very quickly in consulting.
Not my entire life because that's not as relevant, unless you want to know about  my ex‐wives and all my children, which I am glad to share. I will then stop as I tell  you my life and give you lessons, okay. Then we will probably either have reached or exceeded lunch and we will break. After lunch I will then force you to be  immersed in two or three hours of pure unadulterated philosophy. It will be  about preeminence, it will be about being [inaudible 00:12:10], it will be about  your role in the cosmos, it will be about the foundations upon which I think  everything you do has to be built or if you're already adhering to it, accelerated  and not apt up but really taken to a higher level. Then depending on where we  are, I will stop and we'll have a discussion and the discussion will be what  [inaudible 00:12:37], what changes, what perspectives you got from me or … and
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by the way, people don't know I came for you to transform me. No, you didn't.  You came for me to be able to draw at a very [inaudible 00:12:49] whatever  you've got to give to everyone else that they don't know and to give you a  breakthrough that will be transactional and actionable and meaningful when you go home.
If I don't say a word except for ask questions and you get your breakthrough, you  should be so grateful to me, and I'm not saying it to be rude, I'm saying it  because I've done enough of this that you have to … if any of you have attitudinal prejudice about your contemporaries and listening to them; either they're not as  successful as you are, they're fumbling at something, growth comes from looking outside. Growth comes from external focus, it doesn't come from being  consumed with yourself. Then we'll discuss what we learn, questions because I  promised everybody we'd have lots and lots of interaction and we will. I'm pretty much here for sort of the duration. Technically we said we would stop at 6:00, I  can go longer tonight. I have some personal commitments tomorrow where I  can't and need to gauge in the beginning. How many of you are here for the  duration, Wednesday, or how many have to leave early Wednesday? That means  both. Jeremy, you're [crosstalk 00:13:57]. Okay, everybody for the duration.
Male: Duration.
Jay: Okay, good, because after we get through the … not the boring but the  experientially unique first day, we will then start exploring things like positioning,  models, market, competition, various vehicles [inaudible 00:14:25], we will then  look at altering your business model, partnering … we'll look at lots of things and  they're going to be what I'll call modular eyes components that could represent a significant enhancement to what you're doing but is not in any way, shape or  form necessary for you to fully embrace today or tomorrow because on  Wednesday it is my intention, if I get most of what I want done, and there'll be
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Q&A and there'll be sort of [inaudible 00:14:59], so it will be very interactive  because I'm playing with this, then we're going to try to build you … you'll build  your own but I'll be here to help you and expand it or revise and enhance a  rethought serve and action plan and it's going to be a little bit Frankensteinian  because this is the beta.
I'm taking and cobbling together like a super seminar, I like some of the ideology  and we're going to repeat some of it. I've got action planning guides from two  other programs and some are duplicated and we're going to work through it. I'm  not trying to be judged as being perfect because this is designed to be very  intimate and very interactive and I need you to accept what I'm going to do for  your betterment and just count what I'm not going to … I'm not going to be real  replying, I'm not going to follow. I've got 500 or so slides. I'll probably randomly  pick some, stop some, may not even look at them. Just understand I'm  committed to you getting what you want but after doing lots of these I've  learned that doing the 10 step this and that is … it's very cool if you want to be  intellectual in a team. It's not going to make a big difference when you go home.  The kind of stuff we will do will make a big difference.
At the end of everyday, except perhaps tomorrow depending on how we've done because I have to get out of here for one of my children's banquets, we'll do as  much Q&A as you want. Now, we're going to get into digital, we're going to get  into social, we're going to get into … online. However … so we're fully disclosed.  I'm a mad scientist who doesn't turn on my computer. I'm very lucky I have a lot  of business deals with very sophisticated technological people who tolerate my  technophobia and they just dummy down what it is and I explain how to  translate it to the public, but I have here three people who either totally  duplicate the same thing or totally complimentary and I don't even know them.  We're going to do panels and we're going to do free form and I suspect but I  really didn't know in the beginning, some of you who are in attendance might
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have more knowledge than they do. I'm not demeaning them, I didn't know they  would be here, so I had to cover my ass for you guys, so some of you are 10 times better.
This is about sharing, it's not about me. I'm just trying to get you the best we can. Some of you are coaches and I don't know the levels of success. A great good  friend of mine is a prominent executive coach and he's done everything from the  pentagon to the number one performing company [inaudible 00:17:37] 1,000, he still has it too, running the Harvard leadership study and he's a [inaudible  00:17:45] but he's a very brilliant man and he's agreed to let me call in … one of  you does sales training and I didn't know we had that so we have a colleague  who is really good at sales training. He is a little different than I because he does  a lot of formulating stuff and I believe more in advisory but he's got a qualitative  bend. We will call upon him if we need it at different intervals, [inaudible  00:18:07] that we need anything else for, probably prevail upon one of my  friends to talk to us a little bit.
We're going to try to do … this is free form. I thought we had, and it's not a  criticism, I thought we had a conference calling type of a [inaudible 00:18:22]  setup. We don't … we'll probably Skype if it works but we're not going to do  video because it's a joke. I am not … I'm recording this but only for my own  purposes. Not a professional recording because I don't want to sell it, and like the super seminar, a lot of times I do it one time, I never do it again, just to see what  kind of impact we will have. This should be fun, but just you have to tolerate my  process. Are there any questions? Okay. Now don't laugh because I just throw  papers in my bag and I've got to find what I need. Gena [inaudible 00:18:57] my  office, the hotel, I just got papers everywhere because I never know what I want  and I bring all kinds of extra ones. Okay, and Gena, how do I do the Powerpoint?
Gena: Just …
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Jay: Just to click, is it going to [inaudible 00:19:12]?
Gena: We have a little clicker problem but I'm your clicker.
Jay: This is the kind of stuff [inaudible 00:19:17] stop and I worry about it later.
Gena: I'll click if you don't.
Jay: Okay. All right. Okay.
Gena: They'll be bringing one out.
Jay: Okay. There's not one out so you're the human clicker?
Gena: I'm the human clicker.
Jay: That's fine.
Male: I have a clicker in mine …
Jay: No, that's fine. I don't care. If I just click it's okay with me doing that. Hey, we're  … so this is really … this is intimate down and dirty interactive and it's much more fun. When all my friends [inaudible 00:19:50] I used to do very expensive  seminars. I've honestly done a quarter billion dollars of seminars in my [inaudible 00:19:57] days. I'm not … and just so you know it, most of my time today is trying to do deals more than just consulting; equity type deals and everything. I go to  China and Japan a lot and I'm very fortunate at this. We had 850 people at an  event I did in Shanghai and we did a lot of people at $25,000 a piece which was  very difficult but it's not really my fort any more. I really entered a period in my  life, and you guys have to understand that I will underscore for you that if you  possess expertize, that is admiral, but if you sell services, unless you're going to  build a big organization, it's ordinary income.
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If I were reliving my life over, and it's not a regret, it's a reflection, I would have  used my expertize to just take equities in companies because at the end of your  career you don't really want to make $5 or $10 million a year in consulting unless you invest it [inaudible 00:21:01] wisely, you want to basically get equities in  what your doing or residual streams of income or licensed things, and we're  going to talk about all kinds of reflective [inaudible 00:21:15]. The first thing is  making enough money from what you do, but then it's thinking about your  model because I have, and I'm not saying this negatively, I really do have a … I  don't know, probably $10 billion. That was hilarious, I was in … and I'm saying all  this to reinforce what I'm saying for you, not about me.
My life has been deliriously wonderful but I'm in Shanghai two weeks ago  starting this program, very intense because I didn't realize I got a business owner  on a stage, I got a translator next to him or her translating my questions and  [inaudible 00:21:57] interviewer to the audience. There's 250 or 270 people who  paid five grand just to watch, which is a lot in China. These guys paid 25 grand for 90 minutes on the podium. They all filled out a questionnaire, my colleagues  there translated it and they translated every question [inaudible 00:22:16] so I  spent three days reading and trying to understand and that it was accurate, so  we had 90 minutes to [inaudible 00:22:22] with the translation and there's two  kinds of translation; simultaneous and concurrent and I don't remember which is  which but this is the one where you stop so you're burning time trying to get  close.
I've got a translator translating for them, a translator next to me translating what  they say, I've got an audience that doesn't have a clue what this is supposed to  be like and I'm tired the first day because it's very hard. I'm in that green room  and this happy go‐lucky guy comes and we call him the candy man because he …  he's not the owner but he's a principal and he's run a candy company and he's  come to five of my programs and when they started they were number three or
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four and they became number one in all of China and he says, “I want to buy you  custom bear shoes.” You can see I like beat up shoes. I'm not in the really like … I  like ties but I don't like shoes very well and I go, “Well, okay, but why?” He goes,  “We just sold our company for $500 million [inaudible 00:23:20].” Now, I was  gratified that I got a $3,000 custom bear shoes but I probably will never polish  them, but I would rather have had 15% of the company.
As we build your model, those of you who get it, you're going to have the most  wonderful expertize in the world and it may be worth a million dollars a client.  You may get five clients a year but if you don't figure out what to do with the  cash load to build yourself wealth, I can promise you three things; I train more  experts to be me than you can imagine and most of them are emulators, some of them are modelers, some of them are outright plagiarists but the ones that you  resent the most are the innovators. They take your stuff and they take it to  higher levels and that will happen. Peter Draker said if you're not constantly  committed to make yourself, your model, your business obsolete, you can rest  assured your competitors will do it to you and for you and I'm saying that in the  beginning because our first goal is to get you more success.
Our second goal is to explore tomorrow or Wednesday morning what models will get you more, let's call it, sustainable either passive or equity type or at least  value that is perceived by outside markets that people want. Whether it's for …  it's earning capacity or it's strategic value and there's lots of models and we'll  explore them but I'm saying if you want to know, if you were interviewing me  what I would have done different in my life, I would have probably done the  training for therapeutic purposes, train more people but not cared about the  economics and only done deals where I kept interests in what I created. That may or may not be applicable to your current model but I'm telling you it's very  important.
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Okay, let me see … I've got two things I want to do and say and then we're going  to have us a very interesting time learning about [inaudible 00:25:36] on the …  hold on. I got this. Okay. All right, so … my board, don't worry about it, I don't like it. The concept here, at least the working concept, we might change it. We might  decide by tomorrow we want a different concept, that we're going to take this  because of what we learn in the discovery process but it's maximizing,  multiplying, monetizing your expertize, skills and abilities. I should have said  much then because obviously and presumably all of you are currently doing  something that is economically gainful in what you do, either significant or  meaningful or decent, externally or internally, meaning you're either consulting,  coaching, mentoring, advising, teaching, writing, speaking or you're doing it  internally as an employee or a contract person, so we're going to change that.  Okay, click. Not yet, didn't do it.
Gena: Okay. There.
Jay: Okay. I drive people crazy because the world wants hard and specific … mostly  we think in terms of tactics but I can promise what will move your business to  the higher status and to the [inaudible 00:27:12] level of not just success but  impact and economic gain that you want, thank you, is … again, anybody can be  … you can jump in and be part of the party because we're oblivious, so you don't  think we're ever purposely rude … just … leadership is not anointed, it's taken in  a bloodless coup. What is your name sir?
Sannat: Sannat.
Jay: Sannat? He just took leadership from us. Okay. I'm very into Socratic interview.  Probably the one skill set that is more than anything else define my success is the ability to Socratically interview people in business and ask really meaningful  questions. Again, the other time in three days to be even functionally worried
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about my ego. I'm not going to tell you anything arrogant, I'm just going to be  clinical about this. I'm really good at interviewing people on a Socratic basis and  the more knowledge I get the better I am because I have my preference  examples I can extrapolate so I can ask you something and it doesn't matter any  more frankly whether I even have ever been exposed to your industry. I've got  465 other industries that I can quickly access mental metrics, so you should learn … there's two lessons here; lesson one is learn Socratic interviewing. I will try see if I can find something good.
We almost did a treaty signing once and I got half way through and through but I  had been taught by masters of Socratic interviewing is interviewing that's not in a hurry. It's interviewing that's totally externally focused. It's interviewing that  really hears what is being answered, processes and drives to mentally envision  what's being said and what it's like in the environment that's being discussed and it's almost as if you're fast forwarding and you're thinking, okay, what's next, or if  there's confusion, you ask lots of clarifying questions. It does two things; it gives  you a context of understanding but it also gives the other side a clear cut  realization you really hear them and being listened to is very important. I'm  giving you a lot of … and I'll try to nestle around this example, but I like Socrates  because he said life [inaudible 00:29:32] isn't worth living. You watch the super  [inaudible 00:29:36] but I believe that a business or a profession or practice or  whatever you want to call it, it isn't constant reexamine and rethought isn't  worth owning, committing to.
This is your life, so I'm here in your life three days. Maybe some longer days,  three days, during your life for the rest of your life. You're the one that has  dedicated, whatever you've done, your background to mastering whatever skill  set that you possess. You're the one that has already decided to deploy it,  monetize it in whatever ways you decided to deploy it and monetize it, you're the one that has the rest of your life at stake. I'm just trying to help give you a
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context of maybe more global understanding of what is possible and also the  probable outcome, the probable paths of outcome that will happen if you  continue down … and not good or bad, just in sort of doing some great clinical  and some very care points and some very sort of forensic hindsight, insight,  foresight, examination of what you are doing. Excellent. Click. I'm not going to try to be a profound [inaudible 00:30:58] speaker because I've had so many different things that I would forget so I've got notes and I'm going to read.
I believe in our lives that we are paid to think, and we are paid infinitely more to  think differently than everybody else about everything else but we can't do that  with that context and that requires understanding that requires not just  education but experiential extensive discovery of a lot more than you know.  There was a really interesting article I was given and I think it was in the Harvard  Business Review or one of the business … and the title was Why People Fail to  Recognize the Obvious. It was written by a guy named Dunning, he was a  professor at Cornell and he found that most incompetent people don't even  know they're incompetent and the reason is [inaudible 00:32:05] also tend to be  blissfully selfish [inaudible 00:32:07]. He believes that the skills required for  competency often are the same skills necessary to recognize competency.
Now I'm not saying any of you are incompetent, I'm saying that there's a lot of  mediocrity, there's a lot of incompetency, there's a lot of superficiality in the  world and it's not anybody's fault but you have to recognize that you don't really  have as many viable competitors as you may think. You probably have it in your  number of generic competitors, an enormous number of alternative competition  and one of the biggest competitors if you really are fighting, if you have expertize is intangible versus tangible, inertia, procrastination for theirs and yours,  procrastination in making things happen, procrastination in people thinking …  that's a competitive issue you have to deal with. I'm saying this as a preference to the rest of this week because I believe that the reason I'm relevant is that I've
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been exposed to so many different real life scenarios and I have been influenced  by people who are my mentors and I realized I've almost self selected in my life,  [inaudible 00:33:33] I'm … there's a phrase I want to share with you.
I'm good at seeing problems and challenges and issues nobody even realizes are  problems, challenges or issues. I'm good at seeing [inaudible 00:33:49] no one  even realizes is tying up their vision, their goal, etcetera and I'm good at doing it  because I'm curiously … I'm hopelessly curious … did I say hopeless … hopelessly  curious … thinking how you get a word phrased wrong and it has a totally  different meaning. I've been attracted all my career, unknowingly … and I'm  reading this because it's very important, to industries and people who have  figured out how to out‐think, out‐strategize, [inaudible 00:34:17] and they've all  looked at their respective situations from these points new possibilities. I realized that in every industry most entrepreneurs are confounded by [inaudible  00:34:29] puzzles, status quo thinking, acceptance and challenging business  dilemmas that they don't even grasp in those cases or don't know how to solve  or resolve them.
It reminds me of the [inaudible 00:34:42] desperation, is it Shakespeare or  Weisworth or Amason and I realized that almost every business and almost every industry, they're stuck but don't even know it. It doesn't mean they're not  growing but they're stuck with different unrecognized or unacknowledged issues  and this is a big opportunity for you but it's also a big challenge. I probably over  the years to go to fascinating ways of seeing things differently. It's been almost  entirely influenced by what I'll call a confluence of being exposed to countless  inventive entrepreneurs in countless unrelated industries and they were all  utterly obsessed. Yeah.
Gena: How are you doing over there?
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Jay: [Inaudible 00:35:27].
Gena: No, I'll take care of it.
Jay: Yeah, almost [inaudible 00:35:30] …
Gena: I'll take care of it.
Jay: … with going beyond what everyone else in their market or industry thought was  possible. Not just aspiration wise but operationally, strategically, even their  perspective on it, they always approached it from a 360 question of what can I,  should I do that's either not being done or needs to be done? The perspective of  the people I seem to attract felt was whatever goal or objective they were  pursuing, it was like being part of leading a revolution, a crusade. They all had an  utterly indefatigable enjoyment, just as I worded here, just an outrageous  passion and delight in what they were doing and they found the work highly  worthwhile and not just for themselves but for the market place they were doing it for and I realize quickly and observed contrast that most entrepreneurs and  you can extrapolate to consultants or clients however you want to, unknowingly,  unintentionally, undeservingly limit restrict and peeve your own and their clients  and your own consulting business, feasibility and performance capability by  limiting your thinking and performance means the ultimate value creation you  can make to and for the market place as well as a performance in the maximum  profit and wealth creation you can do for yourself. I'm … good, this was from  something else but I really … okay. What I want to do right now, but I want to get  my notes on you also, I can make notes and here I'm going to ask you to do  something for me please.
Gena: Sure.
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Jay: I want you to start at one table and not using them, if you could do it too  [crosstalk 00:37:18] here's all the … I think all the forms [inaudible 00:37:23]. Get  these out with the guys so I can find which one to give. They were but [inaudible  00:37:27] and then I want each of you to take your time. By the way, I like  peppermint. You will actually put it on my ears, on my nose, on my toes, it  stimulates the meridians in your brain and you need me to be better than at  [inaudible 00:37:47] because I've got a short amount of time to try to share a lot  of stuff and I don't want to do it … I really don't want to do it in a totally  structured way because that's not going to do the best … after this, so if you're  still going like that, just on a nasty day on the hygiene, I'm trying to keep my  energy levels up because I've been traveling for a long time and I want to be  totally in the moment. When you stand, here's what you're going to do. Lance,  that means your name, [inaudible 00:38:18].
What I do is clearly don't … not too long but I want us to understand you  intimately by the time you sit down. What you do … what you do means, not just  I'm an analytical digital [inaudible 00:38:35], what it means. I [inaudible  00:38:37] figure out whether their data is correct or off. What's the implication?  If it's off they could waste $10 million a year. If I get it accurate it saves … I need  to know what the pay off is, who are your clients generically and geographically.  Who within the field are the decision makers of the client. Not just ideal with  insurance companies but ideal with [inaudible 00:39:03] ideal with the CEO  where I have a multi‐influence. I need to know this stuff and I want everyone else to know this stuff. How have you … what is the service you render and what is  approximately the price point and this is an intimate environment where you  charge a lot or not enough.
We need to know. I can't help you if you charge too much or too little or if it's  priced wrong or it's out of sync with the value proposition, okay. I'd like to know  how exactly you currently market and very frankly and for your benefit if this
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takes all day it's the greatest gift I can give you all because we'll have a very  broad based starting point to reference and talk this, so there's no urgency other  than don't act poetic about yourself. This is all about helping everybody else get  a comprehension and understanding of all these critical things. If you have  multiple selling processes, try to describe them as quickly and succinctly but  granularly if you have multiple products or services propositions try to explain  those. If you go too far I'll slow you down, stop you. If I say, “Okay, make it more  tight … ” I don't have the luxury of being diplomatic, so do not take any  intervention I make as being disrespectful or curt.
Take it as I've got three days to pull out of everyone of you what you already  know, what everybody else doesn't know, what you know that even I don't know, what you know we can build on, what you know we can add to or we can  [inaudible 00:40:39] you know what's going on. Then before you sit down, tell us  what you think is your biggest problem, challenge, issue or opportunity and try  to do it in as close to this [inaudible 00:40:54] I don't much care if it takes five  minutes, seven minutes. I might speed it up but this is really important. Use the  microphone, talk as openly as candidly from the heart and don't be frustrated by  us clarifying questions later on but I won't remember exactly everyone and I  won't take as good a note as I want. Okay, we can inny, minny, miney, mo, we can start there, there, there, there, I don't really care, we're in this for the duration.  Somebody raise your hand in one of the tables. We'll start there and then we'll  move forward. I don't care.
Gena: Who wants to start?
Jay: Okay, Chris. Everyone please be in the moment. Don't let your mind wonder, this  is going to be invaluable, it's a process you've never experienced before so please be connected to the other person and everything they're saying. As they're  saying it, start extrapolating, adapting, adopting, think in your mind what might
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that mean to me? How might that be something I can do? Should I consider that? Is there an application of that, and write it down. You all have to [inaudible  00:42:01], right, did you get everybody pads, Gena? Everyone has got a big pad,  you've got pens, make lots of notes and one last thing, sorry Chris, in my far too  many years of doing seminars, the one thing I have noticed is most people write  critic notes that mean nothing to them when they go home.
We used to tell people, “Try to draw a line one third and two thirds through the  paper … ” that's vertical, isn't it? On the left side, the shorter part, write the idea. On the right side, if you can write like Madley, try to write as much content  specifically because you'll go back tomorrow or in a week and you won't know  what that cryptic note means. It will be [inaudible 00:42:45] because it will be  useless. If you can get as much … jot down right now for yourself and look at it  later because we might … if you get good good ideas we might take all of you  [inaudible 00:42:54] I don't. We might, as a courtesy, I always add value to  everything. We might take all your notes and consolidate the non duplicated  ones and get it typed up for you, and get it … so you've got an incredible  reference list when you go and let's see what happens. Okay, let's go man.
Chris A.: All right. Good morning everybody. I am Christ Alden, Alden Group. I'm from New Jersey. [Inaudible 00:43:17] my father founded the company 25 years ago. We  serviced the investment industry so our clients are various mutual fund  companies, [inaudible 00:43:26] dealers, custodians and software vendors, but  we service a very specific part of the industry and we do this called performance  measurement. Basically the calculation of returns and the reporting of returns;  so managers' gains and losses, how they figure those out and how they report  them to our current clients and prospective clients. Within an organization, our  ideal contact is generally what's called the head of performance measurement. It may be the head of performance, it may be the head of rates, but it's some  similar title like that …
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Jay: Christ I'm going to interrupt you, please don't be … why is performance  measurement valuable to your client?
Chris A.: A number of reasons. From the standpoint of risk, if they are improperly  calculating or improperly presenting performance to their clients, they run the  risk of being … passive position of committing fraud which we know what that  could lead to, things like Bernard Madoff where all those returns were fake, it  was made up and we know what that did. Also from a marketing standpoint …
Jay: You get an advantage.
Chris A.: It gives an advantage, yeah. There's a global standard called the global  investment performance standards. This primarily deals with institutional  investors, so asset managers that manage pension funds, endowment money. In  order to get those investments, they need to claim compliance with this standard and they need an independent third party to verify their claims.
Jay: Do you audit?
Chris A.: That's a good way to describe it. Not actually a financial lot but it's similar, so we  will come in, make sure they have the right policies and procedures in place.
Jay: So it's certified internally but you're not liable externally, is that correct?
Chris A.: We are not liable.
Jay: Got it.
Chris A.: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, and how do you price your service?
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Chris A.: We actually … recently [inaudible 00:45:16] the last 12 months or so made a  significant change in our pricing. We used to price it on sort of a daily rate of  $3,000 a day. We've since started really trying to do value pricing where the size  of the firm we take into account, so a very very small asset management now.  The minimum we will do this for is $7,500 and then it really goes from there. A  very large firm, a firm that manages hundreds of billions of dollars let's say, we'll  start it over $15,000, maybe even more and it can go up from there into tens of  thousands. We don't yet have any clients that are paying us over $100,000 a year to do this for them but we're starting to compete with that type of business.
Jay: Okay, and then what do you get … at the end of the process, what do you deliver  to them and in what form?
Chris A.: They get [inaudible 00:46:05] station letter.
Jay: I love that word.
Chris A.: Yeah. They meet certain requirements. The CFA institute, Chartered Financial  Analyst Institute, they sponsor the standard and they proscribe the writing that  needs to go into one of these letters. When a firm completes the process, ideally, if it's successfully completed, they will end up with a letter that they can provide  to prospective clients when they present their returns to them so they can say,  “Not only are we saying these are our returns bu they've been verified.” That's  the technical term is the verification, they've been verified by an independent  third party.
Jay: Okay. How do you sell your services currently and who do you sell against and  what's stronger, weaker about you?
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Chris A.: Okay. We sell right now primarily direct mail and marketing is our initial contact,  so we get lists and various industry publications will come out with lists of like  the largest asset managers in the world or the largest hedge funds.
Jay: My style is going to be interrupting all this, so please don't … how many  prospective target clients are there in whatever the world you're doing? Is it all  North America, is it the world? Whatever it is.
Chris A.: It's all over the world. Today we have clients in North America, Europe, the  Middle East and Africa. We just started our first client in Africa. There are  thousands of prospective clients, so anyone who wants to compete for  institutional business …
Jay: Anywhere in the world?
Chris A.: Anywhere in the world. Like if primarily they want to compete for institutional  business here in the U.S, things like [Calparis 00:47:42]. Probably you've heard of  Calparis.
Jay: Sure, of course.
Chris A.: They want a piece of their …
Jay: They've got to be compliant.
Chris A.: They have to be compliant.
Jay: Okay, and then is your service recurring? Is it something that's done every year or every quarter or what's the frequency?
Chris A.: It is. It is. We do it annually. There are firms, some of our competitors they do it  on a quarterly basis. The reason we do not do that even though we could charge  more is we think it doesn't add any benefit to the client. Most of the work is
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done in the first quarter, so by doing it across the year four times our  competitors are able to keep their verifiers easier throughout the year.
Jay: Is there a lot more work if you've already done the major one? Is the quarterly  one as extensive?
Chris A.: Yes, it is.
Jay: If you get it?
Chris A.: They do it on a sampling basis so they will look at certain time periods each  quarter where we come in once a year and look at the full period of the year.
Jay: Okay. When you send your emails currently, what would … is it cold emails?  You've got all these different risk manager, [inaudible 00:48:46] whatever it is  performance measurement. What is the email or the letter … what's it saying and what's it offering?
Chris A.: We … verification is the largest part of our business but then we also publish a  journal, we publish a series of books, we host a membership group that meets  two times a year in the United States and two times a year in Europe, we hold  two conferences a year.
Jay: Are they all … and again, my job is to just get the context right. Now we can get  back and get deeper. Are they all separately marketed with separate strategies?  Is it sort of a little this, little that?
Chris A.: They are now. We used to sort of just try to fill everything for people all at once  but now we set up sort of different funnels and depending on the type of firm,  the size of the firm, their needs, we will market to them in different ways but it's  very rare that we would come across a prospective client who does not know  [inaudible 00:49:36].
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Jay: You have a very impeccable reputation?
Chris A.: Yeah.
Jay: … and you would be [inaudible 00:49:40] company?
Chris A.: Absolutely, so we compete against like E&Y, Ernst & Young, Deloitte and Touche,  PWC, and then there are other boutique shops like ours that are smaller firms  that we also compete against. Our client retention rate is above 99%.
Jay: The key to you is just getting the client. Once you get him, you own him.
Chris A.: You have him forever unless for some strange reason they might stop claiming  compliance or …
Jay: Or they get absorbed by somebody else but then those are anomalies you can't  really control.
Chris A.: Yeah.
Jay: What's the biggest … okay, how many clients active do you have right now?
Chris A.: We have about 135 …
Jay: Out of how many could you have?
Chris A.: We could … current staff and we could probably double that. We could definitely  … we could have 10 times that many clients.
Jay: So there's an infinite … there's a huge market, you've got a little sector, you've  got a great reputation, you've got a suite of different products, services, do they  all serve either strategic or economic or PR value, all the other products and  services?
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Chris A.: The other ones like are training and our conferences are more educational from  the standpoint so that these firms can make sure they are doing things properly.
Jay: Are they all revenue generating?
Chris A.: They're all revenue generating, yeah.
Jay: I ask these questions … probably what we're going to do throughout this process  is I'm going to share with you how my mind works. Not that it works great, my  wife thinks I'm crazy but I want to know what you do and why you do it, whether  charging money for it is as good as giving it. Whether changing the dynamic on  one piece of it could get you 10 times more people in an environment … I was  getting [inaudible 00:51:23] last night. My friend Damon John, the guy from  Shark Tank and I said I did … and this is very interesting. I said I went to China to  do these $25,000 programs. In four days we can only do 20 people. We had 20.  Three of them had scheduling problems and we had to schedule and then come  back in April. I did 17 people in four days. Not very many. Very intensive and 250,  300 people were watching. At the end of that, my partner said, “Let's … hell, let's  see if these people are interested in consulting,” and I said, “Okay, sure.”
It was like $150, $300 thousand a piece. 11 … excuse me, 10 out of 17 [inaudible  00:52:08] because they'd had enough of an experience of watching my ability to  transcend scenarios and I'm saying it not about me but we've seen situations  where the reference of an activity or a product service was … you see it as sort of an add‐on incremental profit center winning factor and I'm not suggesting, I'm  just sort of asking you to think about it because we'll come back later and see  what discoveries … maybe something you're doing that's not very profitable but  its education should be something to do for 20,000 people and I'm just asking  that because I don't know. What's the most, not profitable, but the most highly  regarded single ancillary product [inaudible 00:53:00] got. We know that the
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main product is basically the certification and verification … verification, not  certification, verification. Interesting, all this, interesting, but what would be in  the other suite of product services? What's the one that they love whether it's a  big profit maker or not?
Chris A.: It's two and they're both similar. One is called the performance measurement  forum which is a membership group and it's two times a year in the states.
Jay: How much?
Chris A.: $5,500 is a single membership, $8,500 is what we call the corporate  membership, which allows firms to send multiple people to a meeting. We have  about 55 member firms and two meetings a year in the states, two in Europe and then we started a similar group that meets once a month through conference  calls. It's at a lower price. It's like it's $1,500.
Jay: How is that working?
Chris A.: It's growing. Right now we have about … actually there's a call going on today  and we have about 25 members right now.
Jay: Is the profile of the members pretty similar or are they all over the place?
Chris A.: They're all over the place, from some very small firms to some of the largest in  the world and also different types. They're not just asset managers participate in  this. Software vendors who service those asset managers participate [crosstalk  00:54:07].
Jay: Do they pay just a fee or they pay also [crosstalk 00:54:09].
Chris A.: They just pay a fee.
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Jay: Okay, so they're all [inaudible 00:54:13]. Is almost all this sourced from existing  clients or external and depending on the answer do they move into client status  if it's from external?
Chris A.: It's a combination so in some cases it's the think tank calls where the first  introduction of someone to our firm [crosstalk 00:54:33] we basically plan  questions on the call or pause to try to discover opportunities and we have  gained verification clients in that way, so we ask specific questions that tell us  either their current verifier is not doing a good job because they'll answer  something in a way that tells us they're not actually compliant, so then we have a chain of specific follow ups that build to them.
Jay: Good. Good. Do you have … because I remember one time we had a discussion  about something and there was … you had a very impressive … now here has  been an impressive staff. Do you have people signed separately to this or is that  you?
Chris A.: It's primarily me but we recently hired a West Coast sales person from a  competitor who is doing a very very good job. He's very well respected and he's  been doing great. We just about a month ago hired somebody on a purely  commission basis in Brazil to start building our South American business because  we had nobody …
Jay: How's he or she doing?
Chris A.: He's gotten a lot of prospects. He's not closed any deals yet but he is bringing in  prospects pretty regularly.
Jay: When you're competing against the big companies, and let's go back to  verification and when you're competing against the routine companies, what's  your biggest advantage, what's your biggest disadvantage?
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Chris A.: Our biggest advantage is expertize. All of our verifiers …
Jay: Meaning you've got incredible buyers?
Chris A.: Yeah, they all have more than 20 years industry experience.
Jay: Is that rare?
Chris A.: Very rare.
Jay: By the way, don't ever get mad if I interrupt. It's trying to help all of you guys sort of to think about this. Okay.
Chris A.: That's the opposite approach there of our competitors. Our competitors are  especially big for accounting firms [crosstalk 00:56:10] junior level people and it  changes year after year so I think it's the process more painful because the client  has to answer the same questions.
Jay: Do you assign pretty much the same … I may use the word operative because I  don't know the nomenclature to an account he or she will stay within  theoretically forever so they become very familiar with one another?
Chris A.: Exactly. The person builds a relationship where if they have questions they reach  out throughout the year.
Jay: Is that part of the sales strategy?
Chris A.: Absolutely.
Jay: What's the weakness you've got?
Chris A.: The weakness is [inaudible 00:56:36] these larger firms is what we're really trying to get into, the ones that would be worth hundreds of thousands of dollars on an
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annual basis to us. Out point person there sees the advantages of working with  us, but the decision makers above them tend to be like th heads of operations,  Chief Operating Officer, something like that, they have relationships with the  larger accounting firms in a much broader level at the firm and it's difficult to sell  to them, so it's a challenge. We can win our point person but getting [inaudible  00:57:10] the person they have to sell us to is difficult and it's a battle …
Jay: That … okay, so I have two more questions and we're done right now. First of all,  your dad came to a lot of [inaudible 00:57:22] and again would do some … our  recollection is he was in a totally different industry when he started, wasn't he?
Chris A.: He was in the accounting industry but he was much broader focused.
Jay: Broader, okay.
Chris A.: He was centrally … I guess talking about 10 years ago, 12 years ago, decided to  really pinpoint a specific part of the industry, which was actually a good move  because [inaudible 00:57:44] the performance measurement function within a  firm has gained a lot of [crosstalk 00:57:49] things like Bernard Madoff.
Jay: Yes. Is the potential for this, as far as your growth monumentally hurt?
Chris A.: Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.
Jay: Okay, and is the goal to build it, to keep it, to pass it on to you or build it for  acquisition or no goal as far as that?
Chris A.: Not a defined goal. We talk about this a lot because we have had interest from  some private equity firms and things like that [crosstalk 00:58:15]. We think that  if we are going to sell it we want to wait maybe five years until we win some of  these bigger clients so that the value will be exponentially greater.
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Jay: Okay. Last question is what do you think … if there's one lesson that you guys  have learned that's a positive that you could share with everybody here that's  universal and has nothing whatsoever to do merely with performance  verification that is more universal, what would it be?
Chris A.: I think it's the idea of picking a niche and really focusing on it and keeping the  message consistent to them because today if you ask somebody who's not even  a client of ours, “What do you think about this [inaudible 00:58:53] group and  things like expertize, high level service, everything they do they do better than  everyone else?” Even I think it's painful to hear but often when we lose  assignments people will say to me, “Your proposal was the best. It looked the  most professional. The follow up materials you sent were great. Your follow up  was better than everyone else.” They could just leave you on smoke but I hear it  so frequently that I think that [crosstalk 00:59:18].
Jay: … is really just the other issue is what we have to help you figure out.
Chris A.: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, good. Thank you. Great first start. Gena, would you give me a coffee if I  don't have one here please? Okay. Do it around the table. It's probably better  than doing in a … just because it will get a little screwed. Thank you. Okay. Who  are you mystery man?
Chris D.: My name is Chris Dosson. I'm with [inaudible 00:59:40] which is located here in  Oceanside, California, and we manufacture wide stand door systems. We're very  focused on the particular niche of the pattio door base and what that is is the  trend is going towards what these [inaudible 00:59:55] and rather than a slider  that only open halfway, it opens full all the way. My job is to take the [inaudible  01:00:03] improving the product over the past four years my job is to now take it  out and sign up deals.
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Jay: This is high end and one that sort of is invisible when it all opens up, it makes the  room … is that the same thing?
Chris D.: The interesting this is that one of the principals in the company started a panel  window company in the U.K and it's kind of ugly if you throw a white panel  window into a beautiful 400 year old English home. It would just look ugly.
Jay: Yes.
Chris D.: He innovated a system of panel windows that were [inaudible 01:00:31] wood,  so he loves the middle market; he loves the middle class. What he's done with  his hardware is that he's eliminated the hinges on the … most of the systems out  there are bi‐pole doors so they're hinged together like a class door. He's  eliminated the hinges and he's lowered the price point. He's lowered the  manufacturing cost and what we've done, he's created a panel system now.  We've innovated in the aluminum systems in the high end and used the money  from the high end clients to innovate in …
Jay: You've got application that can transform a none‐distinctive middle class home  into something very impressive and give a sweeping openness and it's very cross  effective, it's not terribly hard to convert it and your [inaudible 01:01:18]  knowing how to sell that, however, there's the however?
Chris D.: The biggest thing is we've … we actually had to buy out a partner in the  beginning; one of the equity partners because he wanted to [inaudible 01:01:29]  the dealers and not support them and it was a disaster.
Jay: They didn't know how to sell it, they didn't know what to do with it, it just was …
Chris D.: The hardest things was to …
Jay: … and they didn't inventory much so you didn't even bring in good stock, right?
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Chris D.: Right. Yeah, they … the hardest thing is the install, is basically working with the  contractors because they're not used to the panel. It actually goes back to an old  block frame window style.
Jay: Okay, I'm going to ask for a quick … because I love it's just … you guys have to all  indulge me and I will give back to you but I want to get educated too. Give me  the three minute course and how in the world you retrofit something like that to  turn it into something like what you've got.
Chris D.: It's very simple. We would … the contractor … what would happen is if the home  owner … say a home owner called me up and they have an old slider and they  want to retrofit our system. They've seen it on Youtube and they love it. The  contractor would take that old slider out and he would basically take the wall  back to the framing and then the system would be installed with sheens and  would be blocked in and then the contractor, the hardest challenge …
Jay: It's all custom, right?
Chris D.: Yeah, it's all custom made so I always tell the clients, “Go as high and as wide as  you can,” so we give … “That's what we're here for.”
Jay: … and that gives the most sweeping and beautiful outcome, right?
Chris D.: Yes.
Jay: Okay.
Chris D.: The biggest challenge we've had with the contractors is it's an old system they're  not familiar with it. The windows today just pop in, they can trim it out, it's very  easy.
Jay: Oh, it's old time technology or methodology?
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Chris D.: Exactly, old time methodology so they …
Jay: But it's very reliable, right?
Chris D.: Yes.
Jay: … and it's very solid?
Chris D.: When I was thinking of having drawings out to the architects and doing the  marketing and research and asking them, “Would you [inaudible 01:03:05] this  system?” The biggest thing they said was is that we can put in a beautiful  sweeping bi‐fold door and most of the technology is it's hang from the header so  you're adding extra wait [inaudible 01:03:15], so what the architects told us is  the worst haul we can get is six months later the client sent $30,000 [crosstalk  01:03:23] and it worked. Our system sits on the bottom track, so even if that  header comes down we can actually go back to [crosstalk 01:03:29]. Yeah, we  take the sheens off, push the top track back up.
Jay: You've got great advantage and so your job, you're masterful at knowing how  how to do … I'm going to ask but [inaudible 01:03:38] either recruit or support  distribution, which one?
Chris D.: I'm masterful at going out there and basically recruiting and supporting the  distribution. I've taken on your philosophy of client and revering them and …
Jay: It works, doesn't it?
Chris D.: Oh, it works beautifully. That is my … that is what I have to do. I'm here to set up  a plant and take the dealers, to help them … and what I want to do is I want to go beyond just selling panel doors. I want to build a business.
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Jay: Let me ask you a question. Currently are you independent? Are you compensated by corporate? Are you like a gun for hire? What's the dynamic?
Chris D.: I'm … currently what I've done is the past three years I've built a dealership in the San Francisco area.
Jay: Your own? Successful?
Chris D.: Yes, and I've taken it from zero to about $120,000 a month.
Jay: Is that very profitable?
Chris D.: For a single showroom selling one product, yeah, that's pretty good. $120,000.
Jay: May I ask roughly what do you make on $120,000?
Chris D.: We make about 25% after we pay everything.
Jay: Okay. Is that … have you actively selling or are you teaching people how to  actually sell?
Chris D.: No, I actively sell, I support the contractor, I pretty much do everything. I run the  service there.
Jay: So you've got a nice mid level six figure income which is really good for this kind  of business and it doesn't require a lot of capital.
Chris D.: No, because the clients are paying us, they're putting 50% down.
Jay: [Crosstalk 01:05:14] you're getting inventory after you've spent it out [inaudible  01:05:17].
Chris D.: Yeah, when the product arrives, yeah.
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Jay: Batteries [crosstalk 01:05:21]. Okay. All right, so now you've got a perfected and  eager [inaudible 01:05:29] or at least operating model to first of all use to grow  the business. Are there a lot of dealers right now in the country?
Chris D.: Now, we're pretty much limited … I've really worked hard to keep it in California  and that was a big thing as the principals.
Jay: Because of what?
Chris D.: The product to create this product we had to go through [inaudible 01:05:48] so  there's concept innovation with the product. Also with the factory, getting the  factory up to speed, that' been really hard.
Jay: What's capacity right now? A little further, what's production versus capacity?
Chris D.: They're running … the most … the best month we have half a million [crosstalk  01:06:07].
Jay: Was that a comfortable month or was that a crazy month?
Chris D.: It was pretty crazy. We just hired one of our competitor's production managers  who came over and there was a bit of fighting about that. The [crosstalk  01:06:19]. He supposedly showed up Monday. He came over for two weeks and  then the CEO found out that he was with us and they got really mad, [crosstalk  01:06:27].
Jay: It sounds dramatic.
Chris D.: It is.
Jay: It is. What can the plant optimally do right now with its capacity equipment?
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Chris D.: That's the big question because this guy just showed up there. With the  equipment they have and with the right leadership I think it could do well over a  million. I think it could double.
Jay: A million a month?
Chris D.: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, at a million a month, 12 million a year, that's … is that … they're pricing at  wholesale?
Chris D.: That's …
Jay: That's buying from the factory, that's a million a month at factory price, right?
Chris D.: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, and then what's … does it double, triple, forty, what do you make? What  does that mean at retail?
Chris D.: I think then to be competitive they have to stay … we've been … basically what  we've been doing is retailing it out. We've been retailing in our own shops.
Jay: So when you buy a half a million, are you selling a million dollars of retail or is it  just …
Chris D.: Yeah, that's it. That's it.
Jay: Okay, so you double? Okay, that's what we're trying to figure out. Okay, so they  have the capacity to support right now maybe $12 million worth of retail sales.  That's what I'm trying to find out.
Chris D.: Yes.
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Jay: Okay. What would … if you take a store like your that you said is making … is  doing 120 times four, assuming times 12 it's basically a million too, they can  support maybe 10 of you, right?
Chris D.: Yeah, about 10.
Jay: Okay, how many do they have right now?
Chris D.: We have four dealers right now.
Jay: Okay, and they are in California?
Chris D.: Yeah, most of them are in California.
Jay: What is taking you out of the [inaudible 01:08:01]? What are they doing right  now the other three?
Chris D.: Some of them are doing upwards of … well the location here, and so we have a  location here [inaudible 01:08:08] about four or five.
Jay: Okay.
Chris D.: They were doing about $200,000.
Jay: A month?
Chris D.: … but the salesman was being unethical so I don't know what … we pulled him  out of sales so they just installed a new sales person and …
Jay: At 200 grand would they be operating at about $50,000 a month or not?
Chris D.: At 200, 000 for profit?
Jay: Yeah.
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Chris D.: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, and most of these small operations where that's meaningful … and I'm not  saying 25 grand isn't but if you're a little … and I'm not belittling [inaudible  01:08:40] core persons, that's good money, if you were 50 people it's … then  you've got to really rethink your business.
Chris D.: Yeah, it's a very small … we're running a … I've got two guys … it's me and one  other guy and we're doing 100,000 so yeah, the same thing, maybe one  salesperson, two installers doing 200,000.
Jay: Again I ask the question but I didn't probably let you answer it, are you  compensated or tied to the factory? Are you an independent that has to figure  this all out for yourself?
Chris D.: I have an equity position in the company and I'm also paid for the sales that I  generate but what I'm going to be paid on is the dealership's results. That's  something I need to work out with you too. I would like to figure out a really  good compensation package that's [inaudible 01:09:23].
Jay: Yeah, okay, so you've got the ability to set up dealerships and get an override on  all that?
Chris D.: Yes.
Jay: You've got the ability to provide them with not only the selling system but  continuous, or at least, meaningful support, that support you get the override  from, you don't have the exact model done, the factory, if you make them  successful your equity rises, right?
Chris D.: Yes.
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Jay: Okay, is it equity or is it financial? Is it a payment type interest or is it just equity?
Chris D.: Just now it's equity. They talk about doing dividends once we get to a certain  point.
Jay: How well capitalized is … you said they're from the U.K?
Chris D.: Yeah.
Jay: Is their parent in the U.K or they're all here in …
Chris D.: No, the designers formed this company in the U.K [inaudible 01:10:09].
Jay: Okay, but is she well capitalized?
Chris D.: This was self funded, so the clients paid us 50% to put the product in.
Jay: You're pretty key to this whole business?
Chris D.: Yeah.
Jay: Okay. All right, I get it. What do you think your biggest opportunity is and what's  your biggest problem?
Chris D.: Biggest opportunity would be going into … I guess creating a relationship with  larger dealers and having them use the product. What I'd like to see is have them use the product as a loss saver.
Jay: Why?
Chris D.: When I go to Home Depots and I ask the guys who are selling those doors, he will get depressed for his product. They get a tremendous amount of requests but  how many do you close? You don't close any.
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Jay: Because?
Chris D.: Because they have to pick the client off of the floor after they hear the price. This is a very pricey product and everybody has held their price very well. The reason  that … one reason that we're disliked in the industry is that we keep dropping it  and in fact we're going to a very good show; the builders' show next week and  handing out our price‐list
Jay: At your price‐list are you making profit?
Chris D.: Yes.
Jay: Okay. How many direct, maybe not as qualitative but how many direct  competitors do you have?
Chris D.: We have probably six direct competitors.
Jay: The biggest does roughly estimate how big.
Chris D.: They claim to have sold over two million panels and …
Jay: What would that mean?
Chris D.: … so what would that mean money wise? What's $600 times two million.
Jay: $120 million?
Chris D.: Yeah, so they're the 800 pound gorilla. They called me on the [Inaudible  01:11:40].
Jay: Are they good?
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Chris D.: They're very good at what they do but the biggest challenge I see is in when I go  to the shows, somebody was saying new innovative panel door system and I'd  run over there and I'll think somebody is finally going to beat us and …
Jay: … and it's the same technology?
Chris D.: Yeah.
Jay: You guys are better from what … what's your strength?
Chris D.: Our strength is the product, the fact that it runs on the bottom track, that it's  easy to retrofit.
Jay: [Inaudible 01:12:03] all the other ones at the top?
Chris D.: Most of them … although we're forcing people now to put their systems on the  bottom but all the other ones are hinged, so when the client comes in if they  have a 15 foot opening, you find …
Jay: Yeah, it's going to put [inaudible 01:12:15] stress in the middle.
Chris D.: What happens to the client, what their thing is is they don't have to open that  whole thing. If you push open a bi‐fold [crosstalk 01:12:25].
Jay: Anyone's or yours?
Chris D.: All the bi‐folds, everybody else's system out there if they push it halfway open it  intrudes into their patio …
Jay: So they've got to open the whole thing?
Chris D.: Either open all or close it.
Jay: Yours?
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Chris D.: Ours? They can open one, two, three or four.
Jay: It still looks great?
Chris D.: Yeah, it doesn't intrude in your space.
Jay: Okay. From your training and your support work with your own activities, your  lessons from me, what single generic or universal non‐panoramic door lesson  could you give to everybody here right now?
Chris D.: From what I've learned from you, I think holding the clients in … just basically  trimming them really well and doing whatever it takes to keep them happy has  been the biggest factor because we can screw up the product and the factory can screw it up and I'll still get referrals from people, still get people trying to see  [inaudible 01:13:15] you guys took care of us at last. Here's … the [inaudible  01:13:19] was great and you really really took the time and made sure everything was done right.
Jay: It's sad that one of the things that I would drive you crazy on this afternoon,  [inaudible 01:13:30] get to it is getting into preeminence because sadly and  truthly it's all sort of [inaudible 01:13:38] but most people don't understand it as  the operational and deeply, not invested, but connected level but it's really quite  …. it's quite powerful, isn't it?
Chris D.: It's very powerful and when … I remember a long time when I first got into  business school my teacher gave me a tape of Tom Peters giving this great speech and I remember there was one thing in there and he was talking about [inaudible 01:14:04]. He was with the founder of Southwest and he said, “Tom … ” the  founder of Southwest, and he said, “Tom you know, it really doesn't matter what  we do because if we leave a coffee stain on the tray table people think we don't  do our [inaudible 01:14:19],” and he just … and he goes, “If we lose their bags,
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because we treat them so well, that even a loss of bags, they thank us when we  bring the bag back because we're so on top of it,” that that's why [crosstalk  01:14:32].
Jay: Okay.
Chris D.: Then when you kind of … you definitely reinforce it and [inaudible 01:14:37]  changing things on order sheets from customer to client just to keep that going.
Jay: Good. That's great. Thank you.
Chris D.: You're welcome.
Jay: Okay. Is that you [inaudible 01:14:47]. Yeah.
[Crosstalk 01:14:50]
Jay: Okay. As soon as we go to break. Okay, are we going that way? I don't care.
Rick: I just was handed the mic.
Jay: A bloodless coup. I don't care. [Inaudible 01:15:09]. Early on the first day when  I'm trying to get calibrated, I don't care as long as it moves one way or the other.  Okay, go ahead.
Rick: My name is Rick Barker, I'm from National Tennessee and I'm in the music  business. I'm one of the few people in the music people in the business who …  there's … the problem that I'm running into is what I do now is I help people  navigate the music business.
Jay: What does that mean?
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Rick: What that means is that there are a lot of people that want to get in the music  business, think they need a manager and have no idea what it's going to take.  Fortunately for me, parents keep having babies that want to be famous, so I have a never‐ending supply of clients.
Jay: Tell me exactly what you do and you're the gentleman that you were involved  with …
Rick: Taylor Swift.
Jay: Right.
Rick: Yeah, I launched her career.
Jay: Yeah, get us a little background.
Rick: Okay, so I'm going to stand against the wall so people aren't going to be looking  at my back.
Jay: Yeah, whatever you want. Sorry, I'm not being as good of a facilitator as I should  so just move ahead.
Rick: No, that's okay. I … just a quick background on me, I'm over 21 years sober, so I  spent a good portion of my life being a taker and only looking out for myself and I was blessed in 1989 to pray that God would let me die and I woke up really from  a cocaine addiction that I had. With that, six months later, I'd always wanted to  be on the radio. That was my goal. I grew up listening to radio [crosstalk  01:16:33] absolutely loved it. Six months later I end up getting my internship at  Kiss Fm in Los Angeles, pulling people over, working with Red Peas and all these  folks. I ended up with a career, I got offered a job to go to Santa Barbara. I moved to Santa Barbara with my whole entire radio career there, fell in love with the  area, it's a lot like this, and realized that I could be a big fish in a small pond if I
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wasn't chasing a job. I've always been innovative. I grew up poor, I was a GED kid, my … was in three different high schools. I've never done anything based on  money but because of that money always seems to find me which is awesome.
Jay: Okay. It is good.
Rick: I did my 15 year regular career, ended up starting a touring model where  [inaudible 01:17:24] tell people I'm not usually the first to come up with  something, I'm usually the first to finish it. I've made a fortune play drives and  lazy people and this opportunity came to create something, got the attention of  a guy who was starting a record label. On that record label had a 15 year old  named Taylor Swift and he said, “Listen,” he says, “Would you teach her radio?”
Jay: Were you in Nashville then?
Rick: No sir, I was still in Santa Barbara at the time. I got hired as a [inaudible 01:17:49] regional for a record company. He sent me Taylor to teach her radio. That 30 days changed both of our lives. I wanted to teach, she wanted to learn. Back up a  second, I also coached girls high school soccer, so I realized early on the  difference between a 13 year old and an 18 year old who's about 20 years, it  wasn't five. For whatever reason, I learned how to communicate with young  people and I learned how to listen. Taylor's parents ended up asking me to be her manager.
Jay: Okay.
Rick: Zero experience, just this guy in California with a bunch of weird ideas. Her and I  set out and changed the world. We found the power to internet, we found the  power of building relationships. That's why I like your program, so much is  because she and I were doing a lot of what it is that you teach. We were making  that fan feel like they knew her, and she got to know so much about them before
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ever creating the product that when the product released, she outsold the world. It's because she felt it for that client. After being gone, my last year with Taylor I  was gone 185 days.
Jay: Married? Children?
Rick: Yes, there married. I was living … drive to Santa Barbara, L.A, catch a plane, land  at Nashville, catch a bus. Coming from a divorced family and I get a little … I  decided that God was testing me again. He was about to put more money in my  life than I'd ever seen and I'm like, “Okay, is it going to go out in alimony and child support and [inaudible 01:19:14] my kids.” I chose the family. Best decision I ever made. She completely agreed with it, that helped, and I ended up consulting. I  got a call from Sony Records, they asked if I would be a marketing consultant.  While I'm on the phone with them I go to my wife, go to Google and type in  'what does a consultant do?' Advises on areas of expertize, so I go, “Great, I could do that.” I agree to be this consultant, they offered me 100 grand for six months  and I'm like I like this consulting.
Jay: Now, not that it's my business but as manager were you with her when she was  in the big money?
Rick: I was from zero to $4 million. Basically what her parents did, which never  happens, and I wish everyone had, they put me on salary, which is unheard of.
Jay: Were they wealthy?
Rick: They were. They were smart business people. The dad was the Vice President of  Merrill Lynch. He relocated down. What they said was this …
Jay: Very business savvy.
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Rick: He was, and what he said was I could either … they paid me $150,000 a year in  health insurance which is unheard of [inaudible 01:20:15].
Jay: Yeah, that's crazy. So you were more motivated to really focus …
Rick: That's all they wanted and that's what they said, “You will only focus on her.”
Jay: That's very enlightening.
Rick: Very smart because I wasn't taking crap in so that I could make a check and I wish every manager had the ability to be in that position. It would make a lot of  difference. As a consultant at Sony everyone's calling me up, they want to pick  my brain. What they wanted was basically to get a whole bunch of free  information and not pay for it and hopefully their kids will become the next  Taylor Swift. That's why I did that over and over until I watched a video and saw  Brenard Richard and that's how I found you and I sat there and I went and I  bought the expert's academy course.
In the process of that, I learned that I have a lot of knowledge and a lot of  passion and a lot of people are just confused about the business. I used a term,  the tech‐tarded. They don't understand the internet, they don't understand the  things that they should be doing in their own town to better their kids so when  they show up at Nashville, the [inaudible 01:21:17] Los Angeles, they're get taken for a ride because there's a lot of great people that are out of work right now  that only know one way and unfortunately that way is wrong, so I've tried to  come in to save the day, I don't know if I have anything, so send out a tweet that  just says, “Hey, if anybody has questions about the entertainment business, I'll do it for you.”
Jay: Your tweeting them to your …
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Jay: Okay, go ahead.
Rick: I sent out a tweet, said, “Is anybody interested about the music business?” I  posted a free webinar. First week I did 20 people. Did it the second week two  days …
Jay: These are the free ones or 20 clients?
Rick: Just free. Just … yeah, just come and ask questions. [Inaudible 01:21:58] market  really.
Jay: The questions were they great, consistent or all …
Rick: Very consistent.
Jay: What were they?
Rick: They were a lot of what … do you think my kid has what it takes? What should be working on at home? Are vocal lessons important? How do I set up a website?  How do I set up a Twitter page? I did it the following week, had about 80 people,  did it the third week and ended up cutting it off at 200. Now had I known now  about the power of a list, I would have paid the extra 30 bucks to get those  people.
Jay: Okay, but so not you got …
Rick: Now I got something. Now people are starting to come to town and what I  realized was that everyone thinks they need a manager but no one can afford a  manager and most careers at the beginning stages they just need advice and  they need someone who can offer. I ended up putting together … I called a bunch of my buddies and said, “Look, I have access to some of these amazing people.
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Can I do a free event, record you?” and then that's how I started my membership program, is I had all these experts at the …
Jay: So you got all these guys who'd gotten incredible iconic … or they …
Rick: Sony next to their name, and I paid them. Everybody goes, “Why did you pay  them?” I said, “So you have names of people that they've heard of.” Did these  events …
Jay: Was it online?
Rick: No sir, it was live in Nashville.
Jay: Okay, and how many people came?
Rick: I had 103.
Jay: What price point?
Rick: $97.
Jay: Okay.
Rick: I just wanted to be able to raise that to pay the guys that I'd gone out to see, it  was a total wash. What ended up happening is I thought that I needed to be  physically present, so I offered membership into the blueprint as a consultant. It  was $3,497.
Jay: What did you get?
Rick: They were going to get …
Jay: What did they get?
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Rick: What did they get, which got changed real quick was me live with them online  every Tuesday and Thursday.
Jay: For how long?
Rick: For as long as they had questions.
Jay: Okay. All right. One‐on‐one, one‐on‐one private?
Rick: It was 10 people …
Jay: Okay.
Rick: … so they can all learn from each other kind of like what we're doing. This kind of a setup.
Jay: Then what happened?
Rick: Then what happened is one of my clients became a smart ass and said, “Rick,  what we're doing, what you're teaching us, we're not going to sit at home every  Tuesday and Thursday. You do not have to be present. Why don't you record  some of this stuff?” and that's when my aha moment happened and I went to a  modular form and I laid out the business in Powerpoint. I basically took the  expert's academy's membership program and emulated it into the music  business that [crosstalk 01:24:25].
Jay: What is it called?
Rick: It's called music industry blueprint.
Jay: It's membership base?
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Rick: There's a website which is [inaudible 01:24:34] which I give them the seven keys  for increasing their odds in the business to generate my leads and then they go  through the Jeff Walker model of four videos and then they comment.
Jay: What's the price point?
Rick: $497 for a year membership, three payments of $197 if they choose or $57 for  12 payments.
Jay: Okay, and it's working well?
Rick: It's working very well. What happened and where I'm at right now and the  reason that I'm here is that I needed to go out and build a year in testimonies  because it's so non‐traditional, it's so non hands‐on. I needed to show that I  could coach and elevate people through the internet and it's actually  unbelievable. I use it as an evergreen model which means that people could  comment at any time and I had about 42 clients in that process. I also post free,  all these workshops at Nashville where I teach people. I go … I just did [inaudible  01:25:32] Dallas. I used your thought process and it's weird because I always tell  people, “Jay told me. Jay told me,” just because when I found you it was on a  Youtube video and I was trying to track down who Jeff Walker was and you were  seeking … so I went to your website and I gave you my email and you sent me an  MBA degree. It was the most amazing program that I … and so I downloaded  everything. I drive a lot, and that's when I started listening, but you said two  things that changed my business.
You said one, there are only three ways to grow a business. People are going to  tell you there are hundreds, they're only three; more clients, increase [inaudible  01:26:12] your transactions, more transactions, more offers and I just thoroughly agreed with the fact that I needed to increase my transactions, but the thing that you said most was instead of going out and just trying to find your clients, go find
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people who already have your clients and figure out a way to serve them. I  started thinking, okay, if I create artists, vocal coaches, guitar teachers, guitar  center, we have these things called performance rights organizations, [inaudible  01:26:41] they help the singer, songwriters, so I went to them and I said, “How  can I serve you?” I said, “I would love to hold a free webinar just teaching your  people how to set up their businesses,” and when you have the credibility that I  had in my client, was they were like, “Oh my gosh. Taylor's former manager,”  because with my advertising, I do not advertise, but I worked with Taylor.
Jay: Yeah, is she willing to endorse you?
Rick: I don't want her endorsement because what people hear is that I can make them  the next Taylor Swift.
Jay: … and that's not your proposition?
Rick: No, and it means more when someone else says, “By the way, did you hear Taylor Swift's former manager is giving away free music advice?” That's worked out  really well for my own peace of mind, for my own every [inaudible 01:27:21] dad  in Texas who want his daughter to be the next [inaudible 01:27:25].
Jay: I get it. I get it. That way you got your influencers and they basically got you  access to their affinity groups and now you're on a roll.
Rick: Things are working well. I went to product launch formula in October and  basically …
Jay: … and that's Jeff Walker?
Rick: That was Jeff Walker's program, about 650 internet marketers, I was the only guy in the music business. All the people in my world that have credentials are out  trying to find the next Taylor Swift. They're not in it to what it is that I'm doing
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right now which is awesome. What I did was I was told one, your prices are  cheap, which I understand. Start marketing at less than $10 a week, you get me  as a part of your team. They said that I needed to put [inaudible 01:28:10] to be  on it, which I agree, so I went in and did a proper product launch the week  before Christmas which just … because I had to do one. They said, “You've got to  get one done.” What I did is I reached out to a couple of people with your model  of I had a $97 little video product called the ultimate artist school kid, super  simple, super easy. I offered it to performance coaches and vocal coaches as a  free holiday gift; a $100 gift for their clients, was able to generate 2,500 brand  new hot leads right before my launch. It was worth it.
Jay: That's great.
Rick: Fantastic. What it did more importantly is because of Taylor and because I'm in  Nashville, because of country, I have a lot of great referrals and success stories  from young pretty girls who sang country music. Where was I going to help the  do‐it‐yourself musician? Where was I going to help that rock guy? Where was I  going to help that jazz guy? When I was able to get this guy's list, the vocal coach, now all of a sudden I went from 42 clients to during my launch it went through  December 11th to the 21st, I closed card, people begged me to keep the card  opened after Christmas which of course I did, and I ended up closing at  December 31st was official close. I did 123 new clients. I'm now in 18 different  countries and 14 different genres after 497. I did a little bit, almost $66,000 in 20  days.
Jay: Do you have a lot, any upgrade services, products?
Rick: Yes, it was about to happen and where I'm going with my business right now is  that I'm about to take the teaching to a whole other level through evergreen  webinars. There's great systems and programs that are out there right now. I'm
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one of those guys that I'm very good with being in it. I'm very good with social  media, so I've been creating products that will create residual income.
Jay: For example?
Rick: For example right now I own the URL socialmediapermusic.com, and I tell  people, “Give me an hour and I will show you exactly how to set up your online  and offline business,” and then during that what I was told by one of my coaches  is they said, “Look, you've got things that are of value that take no more of your  time, which is the Facebook group and the membership site. That's stationery.  You need … ” they said, “You need to give yourself … ” and they called it a trip  wire, “You need to give yourself that trip wire, that lower price opportunity to  get in to see how great you are, especially before you raise your price in March.” I did a silver program which is just use your name and password in the blueprint  because it's broken down and the Facebook group and I offered that for sale  inside this one hour webinar and I just started doing that and this is working  really well too.
Jay: Okay. Let me ask you, let me trail back to a point. Needed to build case studies,  success stories, validation. Do you have a lot now?
Rick: Yes sir.
Jay: What would they range? From what to what to what?
Rick: They basically range from those people that had … because I was … everybody  else says, “Do you have any success stories? You need to give me your definition  of success.” I said, “I had a little girl that didn't have a website who now has  5,000 fans who are buying her product. That's success for her.”
Jay: Great.
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Rick: “I have a songwriter who was wanting to secure a publishing deal. We did that.  That's success for them” What I guarantee and promise people is that I will  prepare you for whatever opportunity comes to you. Right now with these talent  shows, Chris and I were talking about this before, is you always hear people say  you've got to be in the right place at the right time and I don't agree with that. I  think you need to be the right person in the right place at the right time to take  advantage of that opportunity, so that's what I'm training people for.
Jay: You're preparing them when the opportunity is there …
Rick: Whether it's to be the biggest artist at your town selling more merch, whether  it's to be on the show, whether it's to walk in front of a producer, whether it's to  get a record deal.
Jay: So there's nobody else directly doing really what you're doing?
Rick: No sire, there's not.
Jay: You have credentials now …
Rick: Yes sir.
Jay: … to die for, you have success stories that are impressive and you're not trying to  turn them into the next platinum record. You're just trying to help them get to  the next … to the best place they can given who and what and where they are.
Rick: Correct, and now the record labels have approached me because they've caught  on to what … I kept this under wraps for like a year because what happened was  is the music business has killed themselves basically. They went out when it was  cool to charge $20 for a CD when the only place you could get it was [inaudible  01:32:42]. Now that the internet is open, we have access to our consumer 24  hours a day, seven days a week. It's never been better.
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Jay: You really don't need the record company.
Rick: You don't you need them as a bank. What I've done is that the record labels are  like, “Okay, wait a minute.” The record companies hire me to come in and fix  what they sign. A lot of times what will happen is they'll get excited about a song  and they will not do their research on the artist so they'll call me and go, “I need  you to fix this person for three weeks,” and I will …
Jay: They'll send you or you'll go there?
Rick: They'll … right here in Nashville, yeah, they'll call me and I'll come in. I'm like you, I have this ability to just listen for a few minutes and then fix it. God blessed me  with that for whatever reason and that's how …
Jay: How do you charge for that service?
Rick: I charge well for that. They … yeah.
Jay: Okay, and is that a big part of your current business?
Rick: I don't want … I want it to be a big part of my business. What I wanted is what  you've been talking about. I want the labels to start coming to me going, “Okay, if this is the guy we hired to fix him, why don't we go see who's in the blueprint,  who's ready to come out,” and then I want to get back in on that signing that  artist instead of having to manage. I want to develop.
Jay: Okay. What's your biggest opportunity, what's your biggest problem?
Rick: The biggest problem is it's just me right now. Is that people want me. I don't have another man. Right now I wake up in the morning, I'm a one man show, I do all  my … what I've done now is that … why I had to see that it works, I had to go out  and try these new ideas because what I was going to do was to walk into
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Nashville and say, “By the way, I figured it out. We give our music away,” and they all looked at me and said, “Are you high? Are you drinking again? Are you falling  off the wagon?” but what I learned from the internet marketers and people like  yourself is that that's just a nugget. It's like if this is the grateful dad made a living out of letting people have their music for free and then charging 30 bucks to  come and just get high and sing along to a bunch of songs you already knew, it's  a fantastic philosophy that Taylor and I did. See when Taylor and I started, we  only had Myspace.
They were all trapped in one location, she went and said, “Okay, what makes you  laugh? Oh my gosh, that's what makes me laugh. What do you like about boys?  Oh my gosh, that's what I like about boys,” and she started writing this record for  them and that's what I'm saying to the labels is you come to me, they will already know how to perform, so they will know how to engage the fan base, they will  already have an online presence. I'm not here to solve problems, I'm here  because of you. The opportunity is like when you offer the terabyte of  information for $2,000. I felt obligated because I had learned so much and  utilized so much from the free stuff that I told the guy at your office, I said, “I  can't afford $25,000 for a day,” so I at least needed to buy this, and then when  this opportunity came up, I came here to listen and to make relationships.
Jay: That's great. That's great. Thanks, I get it. Okay, thank you very much. Later, I'll  tell you, I have a son in Nashville, and he's there working with a company in  Nashville that their whole business is helping artists. They're expanding, trying to get control of their own fans because people don't realize Twitter, Facebook, it's  cool for Twitter and Facebook but really nobody makes money on records any  more. They make it selling t‐shirts and concerts and [inaudible 01:35:50] and …  but the difference if you look at the dynamics between who … how many  [inaudible 01:35:57] they've got in Facebook and how many visit their website,  the breakage is horrible.
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Rick: It's very bad and what I'm teaching is the email and then how to build that  relationship. No one's teaching them that.
Jay: Maybe I'll tell you about [inaudible 01:36:10].
Rick: Awesome.
Jay: My son works for this company and they're trying to basically move control of  the fans back to the artist so it's pretty cool and they're in Nashville. I hear  Nashville is wonderful.
Rick: It's fantastic, yes. Thank you.
Jay: Okay, think next … oh, by the way, Gena, what's the question you need to know?
Gena: There's … the restaurant for lunch is Beilings across the way, so I just don't want  to make assumptions. Do most of you want to go there and I'll make a food  reservation?
Jay: There's other ones in the neighborhood and Beilings is a little pricey but the  food's pretty good, but there's other ones you can [crosstalk 01:36:45].
Gena: You can go to [Zo's crab shop 01:36:46].
Jay: Yeah, so we don't care. We're not tied into it.
Gena: I just want to know how many …
Jay: Just so she can tell them to plan it.
Gena: So I could tell them.
Jay: Looks like the majority will go there.
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Gena: Okay.
Jay: Okay, cool.
Rick: Also too I do have a clicker for that if you want it. I see it through in my bag. I  wasn't joking when I said it.
Gena: I love being a clicker girl.
Rick: You got it.
Jay: Okay. By the way, please don't … trust me, I will get you where you want but  these kind of interactions if you really understand how my brain works, I want to  see [inaudible 01:37:18] things, I want to see what their reality is, what their  models are, what their processes, what's influenced them and it has applicability  to everyone, so there's nobody in a hurry today. We'll get everywhere you guys  want and more, but I want to know about as many of you as I humanly can. Next.
[Crosstalk 01:37:39]
Jay: What time is it right now? Just give me one second to …
Gena: It's about seven minutes to lunch.
Jay: All right, great, you've won. You don't want to … after this we'll take a 10 minute  break and [crosstalk 01:37:54], yeah, we'll do lunch [inaudible 01:37:56]. Okay,  please, sir.
Ameka: My name is Ameka [inaudible 01:38:58].
Jay: It is. It is. You'll get me call you by like a nickname?
Ameka: I'm trying to. Mecca.
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Jay: Okay. Mecca, okay, got it. Okay Micah, where are you from?
Ameka: I'm from Nigeria and I'm [inaudible 01:38:14] what you call an appraisal in  America. Remember we were colonized by the U.K so they kept us there for too  long.
Jay: Okay.
Ameka: My [inaudible 01:38:27] is actually realistic. Real estate in my country is a bit  [inaudible 01:38:34]. What I do on my training is we provide evaluation work for  the banks for people who want to take mortgages.
Jay: Can I ask what workers here in exchange since 2007 or '08 but it's probably 20%  down, it depends on your credit, 50 … what's the model in Nigeria for real  estate?
Ameka: If you want to take mortgage?
Jay: Yeah. How much … and it's been on …
Ameka: First I will explain it to you.
Jay: Okay, please, I would like to know. Is it going to be commercial, residential?
Ameka: [Inaudible 01:39:09] gentleman here before now. We don't even have a  structured model in Nigeria.
Jay: Really?
Ameka: We don't. We have 180 million people, so it's an evolving industry. Because of  the laws are not yet developed as much but the people that are able to access  mortgage are just about 0.0001% of the economy, and they're the ones that  probably work for the British companies like Shell, Chevron.
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Jay: Okay. What's good income there? What kind of money are they making in U.S  standards?
Ameka: If you were working in Shell?
Jay: Yeah. No, if you're a local, you're a Nigerian working in Shell, what are you  making roughly?
Ameka: Some of them make as much as $800,000.
Jay: Really? U.S?
Ameka: Yes.
Jay: Oh, that's big money.
Ameka: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, all right.
Ameka: People in the middle, lower, maybe like $250, $250 thousand.
Jay: That's still good money.
Ameka: Yeah.
Jay: Okay, all right, but then it drops probably and the people make very little.
Ameka: Yes, yes.
Jay: Okay.
Ameka: That's the end of what I do. Now what we do, we help people manager their  properties, we help people buy themselves properties and we also help people
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who have inherited properties and don't have the communication. It would be  difficult for you to understand. A lot of the people who own properties in my  country don't have the documentation.
Jay: Don't have the paperwork.
Ameka: It's worthless to them.
Jay: They can't sell it, they can't mortgage it.
Ameka: They can only rent, and a lot of times because they were inherited properties,  some of them are no more very functional.
Jay: Yes, so they're in bad repair.
Ameka: Yes, correct. We try to help them see how they can change the use and then go  through the processes and get some money out of it.
Jay: Okay.
Ameka: My clients are people who are able to buy, people who have properties to sell,  summit companies, pretty much difficult to get into because a lot of them have  [inaudible 01:41:19] and then the banks do appraisal work for them. We need to  be able to speak to the submitters, mostly the managing directors [inaudible  01:41:33].
Jay: Are there criteria for appraisal? Are you certified appraisal [inaudible 01:41:40]
Ameka: Correct. I'm a certified appraiser.
Jay: Are there a lot of them or very few.
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Ameka: We're about … in my estimation we're about 8,800 for the whole country, but  then the volume of business generated only for instance, so there are huge gaps  on every …
Jay: Yes, okay, all right. Is your business like equally divided in all this or is there one  year that you're much stronger or one year that's more profitable?
Ameka: It could yield better [inaudible 01:42:12] depending on the volume of work you  get in these instances, but the most profitable would be the agency work which  is the real work. You buy a sole property here, the structure required and the  fees …
Jay: … and you do a lot of that work right now?
Ameka: That's the challenge. There are huge competitions. This [inaudible 01:42:33] it's  exactly the same thing in my country.
Jay: Okay, and so right now how do you drive, stimulate, generate your business?
Ameka: We … because of the nature of the country and I will find advantages in two  ways. One, I schooled in the U.K so I have a few friends there and I've got family  and friends in America and we have a huge Nigerian community outside Nigeria,  so a lot of them still maintain and keep up relations in Nigeria.
Jay: You can use them to get [crosstalk 01:43:15] in the country.
Ameka: Yes. In some of my travels I run into people who say, “Yes, I'm looking for this, I'm looking for that,” but the value trend in the country has moved beyond what  they're able to afford at the moment. Trying to put all these things together, but I don't make my answer so …
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Jay: It's okay. I'm just trying to figure out what you're doing now. What do you want  to do? Why are you here mostly?
Ameka: I'm here because I've got three things that upset me and I would like to do. We  have a huge difference in the houses that we have and where we're supposed to  be. I was in Brazil like two, three years ago and I got very fascinated with entry  level homes that were there. I thought that's what we need in my country but it's been a struggle trying to put up a moderate structure. I tracked the [inaudible  01:44:10] doing and pulled that off. Then again I also … we have huge  competition in my country in the industry because the people who are making  the most today are people who are international companies just to put it that  way. A lot of them have, because of the bleak nature of Nigeria, they didn't want  to come for a long time. Now they've seen that it's not as bad as it used to be.
Jay: Has it got more stability?
Ameka: They just are willing to understand that it's not as much as a lot people outside  look, so they come in and hoping to make $1 million they make $10 million, so  they're … and again because the big spenders are also international companies.  We're trying to deal with them and then they look out also the thing that they  offer more personality, more standardized service, more … for all different the  companies, they compete that way.
Jay: Okay, so the first thing that you're interested in is a viable strategy for entry level  homes?
Ameka: That's correct.
Jay: Number two?
Ameka: Number two I want to be able to have the satisfaction of satisfying my client.
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Jay: What does that mean?
Ameka: What it means is that when people want to start homes, they're either in big  troubles, they made the money like yesterday or they've got a major need that  they want, so the process delays and brings frustration on both parties but the  moment we're able to solve the problem for them quickly, it helps …
Jay: How would you solve it? Would you have a fund that would but it or …
Ameka: That's what I'm saying. My challenge is evolving that strategy that will enable me  to live up to my promise. If I say to you I will sell a property in three weeks, let  me be able to do it in three weeks.
Jay: Yes, and is that impractical right now?
Ameka: What is impractical.
Jay: Is your firm large, medium, small? How would you rank?
Ameka: People say it's large but I think it's small …
Jay: How many people?
Ameka: … compared to … we have … I have 25 staff.
Jay: Okay, that's pretty big. Are you all … I don't have a clue, again other than the size  and even the exact location of Nigeria, are you all over Nigeria? Is it only one or  two main cities?
Ameka: I'm in Lagos. At least you know Lagos.
Jay: Yes. I know it but I don't …
Ameka: Yes, you haven't been …
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Jay: Yes, yes.
Ameka: I'm in Lagos, capital is Abuja, and then there are only three, four functionals, so  we have present in the areas basically so we can answer the needs for evaluation work for the different scenarios.
Jay: How do you … what's the third issue that you're interested in?
Ameka: The third thing that I'm interested in is trying to find the … my wife takes too  long, I've been in a new industry, I have to look at somewhere else.
Jay: How long have you been in the real estate and really …
Ameka: That's all I've done since graduation.
Jay: You graduated in the U.K?
Ameka: Yes, in Redding.
Jay: Okay, and so what are you formally trained to do?
Ameka: Instant work. I read real estate so that's all.
Jay: All right. Okay, but there's all kinds of … now is … and with all total respect,  Nigeria has a weird reputation. You know it's basically … they're some of the  most inventive internet scammers in the world. Now I'm not saying that to put  you down, I'm just saying but I get the feeling that the whole climate, not  meaning temperature but just the attitude that there's all kinds of opportunities  emerging but it's sort of wild … we call it wild and woolly. You know what that  means?
Ameka: Yeah.
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Jay: Is that true?
Ameka: That's why I'm here, because you recall that I spoke to you …
Jay: I do, I do, we talked before.
Ameka: I was in Kenya when my son was [inaudible 01:47:54]. We were just having a  holiday and we were talking with an American another man that also was visiting and he had worries that I had to explain and he found it very useful because he  actually got up and walked towards me. Then while we were shopping he  pointed a book to me.
Jay: Yeah, I remember you told me that. That was [inaudible 01:48:18].
Ameka: I read it and …
Jay: I remember the conversation.
Ameka: Yeah, so I tried to come … that program would come through …
Jay: Yeah, it didn't work for you at the time.
Ameka: It's … the point I'm trying to make is that the way you hear these things is the  way I hear it and when …
Jay: Yes, but that doesn't necessarily depict what it's really like.
Ameka: Not exactly, but if you give me a minute, we are 180 million people.
Jay: That's a lot of people.
Ameka: A lot, right. We have … not the exact, but we have about 30% dedicated  [inaudible 01:48:51], then we have about 25% aspiration of crafts who want to
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go to school but they couldn't and stopped at one level and then we probably  have about 30‐40% aggressive criminal class.
Jay: I'm not trying to laugh but it's erotic, they're very clever. They're very clever.
Ameka: They're the ones that have created all the huge problems and some of us who  have been struggling and lying on decency and hard work and all that find it very  insulting most times because [crosstalk 01:48:27].
Jay: Yes, it's got to be. It has to.
Ameka: All … I was trying to get it present at one point one day and I dropped my  Nigerian passport, the guy said, “Hey, 419.” I said, “What is 419?” He wanted me  to give him my [inaudible 01:49:40]. No, I'm Nigerian but you can check my  record and when we started talking, it came to the point that listen, the  information that they're getting, you just come from that very class and I don't  know how that works but the people who have fallen for it, they must have been  interested in criminal work because [inaudible 01:50:01] and I believe you.
Jay: Yeah, but what you're saying is I want to … I've got to bring it to conclusion  because we've got a lot … we've got to break but there's three opportunities.  One, and I used to work with one of the largest Latin America builders of entry  level homes and they were building in Brazil and trying … and India, so we can  talk about a little bit of that. You want to explore alternatives and see if there's a  parallel universe career for you and … but the second one again, what is the  second one?
Ameka: I want to expand the size of my business in terms of the transactions I do. I want  to involve a more responsive and result achieving marketing process. I think  that's my biggest problem.
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Jay: Great. Give me an insight for everyone. It could be a humanistic one because you just made a profound insight. It's got to be very … not just affordable but it's got  to be very difficult when you are generalized and judged as a nation or as a  category by the poor conduct of certain people. Is there any great insight that  everybody can take from your perspective, whether it's working there, working  with the quality people, adding [inaudible 01:51:17] read those, seeing an  emerging economy with aspiring people, any of the above?
Ameka: Yeah. What I could say experientially is always entrusting when people jump in  [inaudible 01:51:31]. The moment the disciplines change. I've got a lot of friends  who have come to say [inaudible 01:51:38] and they don't want to come back.  The story is not as severe. I'm not saying that everybody there is an angel.
Jay: No, I understand.
Ameka: It's not as bad as the whole world has said it to be, and the big problem again, we don't have a creative government that tries to address these things. Other  countries have [inaudible 01:51:55].
Jay: You have resources; the oil.
Ameka: Correct, we have. Our big problem is that we just haven't been having to be  blessed with good leaders. That we still are going through that. Our democracy is  evolving.
Jay: What about you … is … on the effort side is the educational system good?
Ameka: Because of the government policies, the local [inaudible 01:52:22], that's why a  lot of our children are …
Jay: You sound very well educated but you said you were in the U.K.
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Ameka: I started in Nigeria.
Jay: Were your parents prosperous?
Ameka: Sorry?
Jay: Were your parents prosperous?
Ameka: I will say yes.
Jay: They sent you there?
Ameka: Sorry?
Jay: They sent you to the U.K?
Ameka: My father actually schooled in the U.K.
Jay: Interesting. All right.
Ameka: He was able to … we were A level in my house and we're all graduates.
Jay: Wow! That's wonderful.
Ameka: [Inaudible 01:52:47].
Jay: Those are expensive. What did your dad do?
Ameka: He was an engineer. He schooled in Wales and he was one of the pioneer staff for building the rails and then he became an industrialist and …
Jay: Oh, this could be a … all right, thank you very much.
Ameka: Thank you. Thank you.
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Jay: We'll do one more then we'll break, and I know you guys are not used to this  dynamic but the time we get to all of you and it's three in the afternoon, it will  be very helpful [inaudible 01:23:12]. You'll understand each other, and can relate  to one another's models, problems. You guys will have wonderful dynamics. One  of the things I've always said at my activities [inaudible 01:53:25] programs, once I realize that the inmates can get as great value as the wardens. It doesn't matter  who, how, where, what dynamic, what permutation you get, your breakthrough  is all that matters. Really, is your breakthrough. I'm nothing more than a catalyst  and an advisory. Yes sir, hi.
Steve: Good morning. I'm between you all and a break, so there's no pressure here. My  name is Steve Thompson and I've got a consulting business called Line of Sight. I  work with sales organizations on how to position, negotiate and close critical  deals once they …
Jay: Larger, normally companies?
Steve: Normally larger companies, Fortune 100 is my customer base, but I also work  with buying organizations trying to figure out.
Jay: For example?
Steve: Fore example I have Walmart is my biggest customer worldwide. They involve me in to consult with their buyers on the deals, they negotiate with their critical  suppliers, so you're looking at Coke, you're looking at Craft, you're looking at  deals that are hundreds of millions of dollars.
Jay: Are you teaching a derivative of negotiating a … not just done but buying?
Steve: Yes, I'm on both sides of the equations, so I mean …
Jay: That's insane.
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Steve: Walmart brought me in. Their competitors will go out and do training and they  heard about me, brought me in to talk to them and I've already done two dozen  major deals on the other side of the table from Walmart with some of their  biggest suppliers, so I could tell them they didn't get good deals.
Jay: It's like hiring the district attorney to be the plaintiff's …
Steve: Yes, basically. I do the same on the sale side. My business has been very good, it's been good to me, I probably …
Jay: What's your pricing model?
Steve: My pricing model runs several different tiers, and one is I'll have a daily rate that  they'll bring me in, they want me to talk to the organization. The sales … we'll say it's the sales kick off meeting or whatever the case may be and I'll charge about  $20,000 to come in and talk to them which is I'm being paid to sell.
Jay: I understand all the good while.
Steve: That's one pricing model. Second one is I work on a monthly retainer.
Jay: Which averages?
Steve: Depending on how many deals they want me to work on it could be $50 to $100  k.
Jay: What's the duration?
Steve: Generally, when you look at the sales cycle of these deals it's at least six months.
Jay: That's great.
Steve: I prefer 12 because we need enough runway to …
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Jay: I totally agree. Are you committed partially or fully to them when you do those  kinds of deals?
Steve: Basically, I'm in a position … and it's interesting because right now and the reason I'm here, one of the largest software companies is just retain me to revamp their  whole sales organization worldwide. They've got to sell differently. They've come  to realize 90% of their business comes from existing customers and that's my  niche, because you have to sell, negotiate and deal with those customers  differently than when you're going out to get new business.
Jay: Give us a three minute [inaudible 01:56:30] on what the differences are  psychologically, attitudinally in respect and also in what's going on in their head.
Steve: A couple of things. One, if you've all been in sales or traded in sales, just about  everything you've been trained has been a linear model. Sales process has a  beginning and end if you close the business. Negotiation has a beginning and  end. You negotiated the deal. A company has a beginning and an end but that's  not the world that they really live in. when you look at it from the customers'  perspective and that's why I learned this because American Airlines, Quart  Mining, a bit mining company brought me in to work with them and they said,  “We need a different way of looking at our long term vendor relationships,” and  it's not a linear relationship, it is a cycle if you will. Therefore, if you think about  it, the way you negotiate this deal is going to impact the relationship on the long  term, you've got to negotiate differently. The structure of the deal has to look  differently because you have a strategy you're trying to execute and the other  side does too. That informed kind of a way you interact and just to make it very  simple, I can teach you to be a great negotiator, but if you're having the wrong  negotiation, you're not going to get the results you want.
Jay: Even if you win initially, you're going to lose.
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Steve: You're going to lose in the long haul.
Jay: Yeah, I got it. What's your background to possess this concept?
Steve: Probably none that's relevant. When I first got out of college, I was pre‐med,  decided I didn't want to do that, tried engineering, bored the hell out of me. My  fraternity brother said [inaudible 01:58:08] smart, the navy has got this thing  called a nuclear power program and they only accept like 2% of the Africans, the  ones who try it, and I did, and I was surprised when they accepted me. I was a  submarine officer for a little while, driving subs around, which has nothing to do  with what I do because the navy doesn't [inaudible 01:58:28], but you learn an  awful lot about dealing with problems because you can only run 300 feet. That's  as far as you can run away from the problem.
Jay: That's interesting.
Steve: When I got out I got in sales.
Jay: Okay, what kind?
Steve: I was selling in the technology arena.
Jay: Okay. Early in the game?
Steve: Pretty early in the game and by the way I am a techno‐phob. I will tell you right  now. I was looking at the business … okay, it didn't [inaudible 01:58:55] object,  it's what do you want it to do for you?
Jay: Perfectly stated.
Steve: Okay, and I'll tell you I had my first iPhone, my wife and kids are [inaudible  01:59:03] getting out of the Blackberry world and I'm starting to love it, which
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really brings me to why I'm here. My business … yeah, probably I'm boring you  with all …
Female: No, no, no.
Steve: My business … and by the way I do what you do when I'm working on …
Jay: Do you agree this is a powerful process.
Steve: Oh no, I love it because this is how I do my business with real accounts, so I know what it's like going that side of the table, not this side. I can only go so many  places with so many fans. Last week I was in Germany and Poland and I'm  probably going to borrow some of your peppermint here before long because  I've got to fly out on Saturday and I've got to go to Paris next week. This business  model was strapping a [inaudible 01:59:43] but you know what, it's getting old.  I've looked out at the people I'm dealing with and they're getting younger and  younger and I'm kind of the old guy now and they want to consume things  differently and I think that technology is where I ought to be and where I can  leverage what I know and what I do and not have to [inaudible 02:00:06] all the  time to do what I'm doing and I'm in a position right now, where as I say, this  company has retained me for the full year, I've got the bandwidth and the time  to really focus on revamping my business which is what my admin assistant and  my wife have been keeping me over the den on for the last couple of years.
Jay: Okay, so it's pretty pleasant. First of all, who are you competing against? What do they do better than you, what you do better than them and what other services,  products do they offer that you don't?
Steve: In terms of who I'm competing against, you've done all your traditional trading  companies that go out and run training, I really don't consider them competitors.
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While I will run a training event, I felt in my business that I tried to say what I call  a [inaudible 02:00:56] away from the real lend.
Jay: I love that.
Steve: I work on big yields.
Jay: I love that.
Steve: I stay relevant real fast and my value proposition [inaudible 02:01:06] and by the  way I know the way I get paid is on a contingency basis. [Crosstalk 02:01:10].  When it's closed we set the metrics ahead of time, what are we trying to move  the needle on and determine what it's worth and get paid on that.
Jay: Is that a big part of the business?
Steve: Not as big as I'd like because the funny thing is everybody jokes all over it until  the CFO runs the numbers and they're like, “Do you have any idea what we're  doing? Look at this guy.”
Jay: I really love it in the beginning. They don't like it when it looks like it's going to  close.
Steve: Exactly. Even though it's not money in the piggy bank today, it's all foul money,  there's still the way they work, so usually it goes with a container basis. I'm not  competing against these trainers par say from that perspective. What is it they do better? They've got books, they've got marketing co‐brands, they've got  websites. I don';t have a website by the way.
Jay: How do people find you?
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Steve: It's funny, I don't do any marketing any more and the companies that I've worked with over the years, these people have advanced, they've moved on, they've  gone to other companies and they give me a call.
Jay: So your word of mouth is free.
Steve: Yeah.
Jay: But it's erratic, isn't it?
Steve: It is somewhat erratic. You can't depend on it. I'm not driving it. I'll be in  Singapore and the phone rings and it's somebody in the U.K that wants to talk  about …
Jay: What's your capacity in … you've got two or three, you've got buying, selling,  presenting, training, contingent negotiating. What's your capacity in each of  those? How many can you really handle concurrently?
Steve: I'm about maxed out on that the last year. This last year was the best year I've  had and I've realized this is not [inaudible 02:02:47] model. Now, tried bringing  on new people, tried teaching them what I do. Funny thing is science is not what  you'd bring some newbie in and practice on their business, on real deals, in real  dollars. That hadn't worked real well for me.
Jay: What's the most successful, single scenario that you've done that was the most  profitable, the most … if you had … whatever your capacity or you could leverage  that capacity, what's euphoria for you look like?
Steve: Euphoria for me would be able to do a couple of things past on what I know and  what I do to a bunch of broader audience.
Jay: Is it clarified in any way right now?
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Steve: In terms of this intellectual property clarified? No. You really can't clarify a lot of  this stuff.
Jay: Tell me.
Steve: Okay. By the way, I'm happy to give it away, and I just … I'll go in and I'll say, “Here it is. Here are the concepts,” but I also know you're not going to be able to  execute it.
Jay: See what [inaudible 02:03:47] without the nuances it's useless.
Steve: Exactly.
Jay: It's useless.
Steve: Yes. Bring up the nuances and the context and …
Jay: I agree, I agree, I agree. We're home over here.
Steve: [Inaudible 02:03:57].
Jay: What would it be though if tomorrow morning you had whatever would be  euphoria in whatever replicatable form was sustainable because you get what I  said. I don't care if you made $3 million last year, you did it. If you're sick, it stops, if you do well it may be the end of the relationship. It's a very … there's a lot of,  not treachery, but there's a lot of irony in being really good at something very  unique. What's optimal?
Steve: Optimal for me, I want to make money honestly.
Jay: What does that mean to you?
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Steve: What that means to me is that I think I can leverage technology with videos and  the other things so that your subscription basis or whatever people can buy in  chunks, small bits, 13 minute videos, whatever, that they grow upon because I  found this younger crowd, they do consider them differently but you know what,  they want to consume like this.
Jay: Who would be … let's presume you had a reasonably passive vehicle that can be  whatever … it can be [inaudible 02:05:13], it can be membership, it can be all you can need, it doesn't really matter, who is the optimal target? Not necessarily just  age but say [inaudible 02:05:24 ] generic, where are they on the food chain and  why.
Steve: Sure. Right now I deal with the executives that are charged with changing  something and that's sort of a go no‐go with me. If they want to keep status quo,  there's no value in me coming in because they already got that. I need somebody who owns the responsibility for changing something, so it's usually an SVP, it  could be higher, but somebody who has got to go make something happen.  That's what interesting and intriguing. The flashback to your question of what  does Nevada look like? What would be great at the end of the day I'd like a  business model that scales with the technology. I'd also like the opportunity to  pick and choose because I love going into nasty situations and helping clients  turn then round.
Jay: Like [inaudible 02:06:12].
Rick: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely.
Jay: Okay, I get it. I get it. Okay, that's a good start. Thank you. Now you're going to be a plan. Let's take 15 minutes and you can talk to each other, and what time is it?
Gena: It's 11:20.
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[Main interview ends at 02:06:27 ‐ Crosstalk to end]
Jay: Yeah, and please don't be impatient if this takes longer than I thought. It will be  invaluable and I will move with enormous [inaudible 02:06:37] later in the day or  tomorrow. We'll see where we go, but this is interesting, isn't it? I hope you all  take … it's okay, just hang out, I'm going to walk around, think about a little bit.  I'm impressed and delighted. [Crosstalk 02:06:49] See, you are literally welcome  but let me give you the user's guide to this, okay. If you're right over there  candidly you'll see the opposite [inaudible 02:07:03] definitely don't got pee.  Serious. [Crosstalk 02:07:09]. Wash your hands really well so you can put it here,  you can put it here or even up in here, here inside. There's a place up here but  that will make your eyes hurt, you've got to be careful, but you often can use it as much as you want. Just be very careful. You can accidentally hurt yourself. Not …  it's not permanent but it's very …
Male: It's uncomfortable, right. I appreciate that. I've just … I've got to get the jet lag on flight through.
Jay: Yeah, I get it all too well. I came back from China and I had to do two things after  that since then, but I was [crosstalk 02:07:45] even if you're … I mean royally, you go to dinner and you don't want it, and you've got food you don't want, you go to sleep with [inaudible 02:07:55], you've got to meet people that you don't always  know you're going to meet. It's never as [inaudible 02:08:02]. We're going to  have three people working on this. I'll be very quick and we pick that, [crosstalk  02:08:11]. There's not just disrespect but it's just not only [inaudible 02:08:23],  the energy and the [crosstalk 02:08:31].
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